Will the 996 ever be a future classic?

[Thunderace]

Will it self destruct....probably

996s don't self destruct at all in my opinion, much of it is money making by garages/solution manufacturers as far as I'm concerned.

From what I've seen most engine issues seem to be low mileage "garage queens" which is not good for these cars (or any others), cars which are used as dailies I have rarely heard of failing but all cars have their potential issues.

Whenever I hear of bore scoring I think .. was it driven like I do and never revved over 2.5/3 before fully warm? was it regularly serviced with the correct oil etc.?

 

[berni29]

Hi

With respect to borescoring.

From my understanding there are a few contributing factors. One is the geometry of the engine. This is the main reason that the Tiptronics are worse than the manual cars and will score earlier. They tend to pull away in 2nd gear and this labours the engine at low rpm. Always pull away in 1st if you can.

Another is the SAI system which causes the car to add fuel when starting from cold (washing the bores). Never let these engines idle to warm up. Get driving immediately to shorten the warm up time.

The above is based on my research and personal experience.

Berni

 

[bazhart]

I haven't had time to read previous posts (sorry) but when I started Hartech Automotive - I took my presentation to the bank which included a review of prices going back decades and what that showed was that ALL PORSCHE's initially depreciate a lot, then level out for several years and then start appreciating again.

When they start appreciating the more desirable and rarer models appreciate the most.

Who would have thought that 911's we sold for £10 to £15K 35 years ago would now be worth £80-100K? (wish I could have afforded to store a few back then)

944's, 968's 911's, wtc etc all appreciate in time.

Whether that is financially beneficial is a different matter but bearing in mind that most cars cost £3-4K/year in running cost sand depreciation - to own something that doesn't depreciate eventually pays off and in the meantime you own a fabulous model that provides huge pleasure to many motorists.

Rarity always fuels desirability and with my other "motorcycle enthusiasts" hat on it is amazing how valuable really old models have now become.

Looking at running costs over several years and combining that with appreciation makes perfect sense financially - even if you have to have some of the worn out components properly repaired.

Meanwhile you can enjoy brilliant cars that put a smile on your face just to own and even look at them.

With Internal Combustion Engines eventually banned - i am confident that these icons of the motoring World will become gold mines eventually - but it is a long term view so while there seems little doubt that whatever they need to maintain them is justifiable long term - I must agree that those weaknesses can make less sense for short term ownership unless the work that has been carried out adds enough to the value through the quality and reputation of the people that did it.

Baz

 

[gunner]

A good reply from the last poster. My opinion for what it's worth. Not every Porsche enthusiast has loads of money, so i see that group buying what they can afford and fixing the known problems. I am in this group having owned 911s for over 30 years. I decided to go down the fixer up route having purchased a 996 1 for 12k last year, but then a low miler reared it's head which i purchased instead. Will it self destruct....probably, but all 911 engine's need major work at some point....I love my new 996 and glad i bought when i did as good cars are on the rise already and are rarely found on ebay etc. Go get one with your eye's open.

Agree with this.

Sold my 993 a couple of years ago as I didn't need/want a £40-50k car sitting in the garage for very occasional use. After a couple of years in a Caterham, I'm now coming back to a 911, but it will be a 996 C4S.

I think the (controversial) looks are aging really well and it's a much more interesting proposition than a 997.

 

[Dammit]

This is the cheapest 996 available in Singapore, it's got a year left before it can't be driven anymore unless a fresh ten year licence is purchased for it ($138,000 when I last looked).

 

[Winny911]

Looks more like a 997 to me

 

[Dammit]

996.3

 

[Justy]

I doubt it will become a future classic or investment piece like earlier 911s have become. Firstly there is the volume of existing 996s out there so by the time the majority have been scrapped over the next decade to create the kind of liimited supply to sustain a high market value, the amount spent to preserve your car will exceed any appreciation in the car’s value. Then what is unique about the car is not unique to the 996. The 997.1 has more chance of becoming a classic than the 996 due to its classic look. The 996 is quirky for sure but incredibily desirable? Not really. There is no air cooled Metzger; no unique mechanical attribute that is unique or not shared with the Boxster.

However, it is a car worth keeping and running which matters to me. Parts will continue to be available, companies will continue to operate to rebuild the engine and gearbox, and the community will be alive share the knowledge of keeping these cars on the road. The 996 is at the apex, where it was advanced enough to have performance the older cars did not have, but simple enough that it is not plagued by tricky electronics. I don’t think the 991 or 992 will be as easy to run when they are 25+ years old.

 

[Alex]

What defines it being a classic - the price tag?

Just for perspective, the last 2 air cooled 911s recently purchased by friends/members of this group weren't much difference in price than current value of base model 997s and cheaper than some 996s I've seen for sale.

 

[jonttt]

They have both spend some wonga on them since though :hand:

 

[Alex]

They have both spend some wonga on them since though :hand:

So do 996 owners if they wanna keep them mint! :wink:

 

[T8]

What defines it being a classic - the price tag?

An interesting point.

I've always thought of cars being dubbed 'classics' primarily due to their age.

Porsche seem to see 20 years as being the age that their models are deemed to be classics. Personally I've always thought 25 years+ as being more appropriate.

Classic Car shows and auctions seem to be dominated by cars from the 20th century and tend to feature as many 'ordinary' cars as 'special' cars.

Earlier on in this thread I said that I thought that the 996 was becoming a 'modern classic'. By that I meant that it has just reached an age when it would be considered 'classic'.

There is definitely some ambiguity about the term though as many modern cars are often hailed as 'future classics' as if to infer that they will be deemed classics by something beyond simply age.

 

[Griffter]

What defines it being a classic - the price tag?

I don’t think it’s ever been successfully defined!

Personally I think it’s when a car is appreciated because of (as opposed to in spite of) its idiosyncrasies.
More objectively, perhaps it’s when the value increases - probably due to the former.

 

[Justy]

I guess in the broadest possible definition, all internal combustion cars will eventually become classic. Like for instance if someone sees an original Game Boy, they will say "oh, what a classic!" Or it could mean a classic design, to which all 911s are classic. However, within the OP's question, whether it is of investment grade or whether someone looks at a 996 and does not just think old car but desirable classic car, that's maybe another question.

My father had one from new, (tiptronic, all wood inlay options ticked). He paid full wack back in 1999, and it was part of the family for 15 years. I bought mine (manual, next to no options - just the way I want it) with more overwhelming positive personal experience than negative market opinion. Its funny because back then it was an expensive, high-end, desirable, performance car and now it's tryingot shake off it's bore-scoring, IMS, odd-ball, "its worth less than your Fiesta mate" kinda car. Back in the day the 993 Turbo was still being produced (just about to be discontinued) and I said to my dad "why don't you get that one" (was in the same catalogue back in 1998) to which my dad said "I want the new car, not that old fashioned one." Back then the 996 waitlist was over a year and wherever we drove, the 996 was fawned over. Oh how times have changed!

 

[IMI A]

Back in the day the 993 Turbo was still being produced (just about to be discontinued) and I said to my dad "why don't you get that one" (was in the same catalogue back in 1998) to which my dad said "I want the new car, not that old fashioned one." Back then the 996 waitlist was over a year and wherever we drove, the 996 was fawned over. Oh how times have changed!

Superb times. I remember those days like yesterday. I liked both models but fawned over the 993 turbo myself. It was a 959 for the masses for me.