993 Targa - Back on the road at last - advice needed first

[2oldn2slow]

Well almost and apologies for a bit of a long thread!

I have a turquoise blue 1996 Targa that I bought in Dubai when I worked there several years ago. In 2014 we moved from Dubai to Singapore and didn't want to part with the car so I exported it back to the UK as part of a longer term plan that we would spend significant time in Europe hence the LH drive wasn't an issue.

The car was built for the gulf states which means it has M150 option which basically is for leaded petrol which means no CAT and no oxygen sensor.

This isnt an issue in the UK as advised by another very helpful poster, I got a letter from Porsche stating the car would not meet UK emissions targets and it is therefore tested at lower emissions levels and can still pass an MOT.

After Brexit, the time we can spend in Europe at any one go is less so that kind of scuppered the plans a bit. Roll on to this year and in Feb our workload died down a lot due to Covid and oil prices, my contract ended and after 9 yrs abroad we returned to Europe in June.

Instead of returning to blighty, we went straight to France which was rather a challenge in the middle of a global pandemic however we survived, we are living in France and have applied for residency etc etc which we could provided we were living here before year end.

So the challenge now is to get the Porsche here. I have obtained a Quitus Fiscal that states VAT was paid in an EU country which means I can at least bring it here and try to register it in France without paying VAT.

Most available information says you can register a car in France if it has a EU c of c but bad luck, they only came available in 1997!

I have a UK MOT for the car and there appears to be a possibility I can register it here with that but maybe not and if not, then the only way is to put it through some vigorous testing. This would be fine if France accept the same type of exemption as the UK for emissions but I do not have this confirmed and am waiting Porsche France to advise.

The other way is to get it emissions compliant which is not too bad a job and fortunately the same poster as mentioned above has actually done this and provided a great write up on what is required. The crux of this is the empty cat in the exhaust needs to be be replaced with a full cat, an oxygen sensor needs to be added and some wiring needs to be done or the rear wiring loom replace.

So my questions are:-

1) Is there anybody out there doing CAT refurbs or can fit new cells to an empty CAT

2) If the answer to 1) is no, what are the best CAT options taking into account I am more interested in emissions than performance improvements

3) Any recommendations as to where I could send the car for the wiring work and getting the car set up properly for emissions etc - currently the car is in Cumbria.

Any comments and advice welcome. Heres the car:

 

[Cameltoe & Heel]

I know that Gert does CAT inserts, so send him your CATS and he will install 100/200CEL whatever you'd like. Beauty of this is that they fit into the existing CATS so no refit issues.

I remenber seeing your car some years ago and it was an inspiration for me during my project

Trev

 

[cableguy]

There's always a couple of complete Cat units on eBay. Just check whether you're Bischoff or Gillet fitment and purchase accordingly. :thumb:

C.

 

[2oldn2slow]

Thanks for the answers. Any suggestions for where to get the work done in the North West?

 

[Gwsinc]

Also worth checking your ECU is able to process the o2 sensor signals, could be as simple as an EPROM chip reprogram (although I think some 96's have an unprogrammable chip, so worth checking).

This has been discussed over on Rennlist: https://rennlist.com/forums/993-forum/553087-diy-m150-no-cat-or-o2-sensors.html

Hope this helps!

 

[Endoman]

Thanks for the answers. Any suggestions for where to get the work done in the North West?

Ninemeister, Warrington. Tech9, Liverpool.
I have found a brilliant one man band in Adlington, nr. Chorley, he gets some really exotic cars in. (PM me for details)
Unit 11, Warrington if they are still going.

 

[2oldn2slow]

Also worth checking your ECU is able to process the o2 sensor signals, could be as simple as an EPROM chip reprogram (although I think some 96's have an unprogrammable chip, so worth checking).

This has been discussed over on Rennlist: https://rennlist.com/forums/993-forum/553087-diy-m150-no-cat-or-o2-sensors.html

Hope this helps!

Hi Gwsinc. Thanks for the input. I dont believe the ECU needs to be touched. This whole process of converting an M150 car to meet the euro emissions at the time was done a few years ago by a fellow forum member and I have all the information.

Here is an extract of his info:

"Ok next thing is to either find the coding adapter (see pic) and remove it so you go open circuit, I couldn't find it, so the electrician cut the wire to pin 54 (see PDF page 3) This info explains the coding. This coding adaptor makes the DME think that there is a CAT on the car and sets a fixed point for the CO, once a CAT is fitted along with the oxygen sensor the CO is variable. "

Thankfully all seems to be ok and just needs a good auto electrician to make the mods.

 

[2oldn2slow]

Thanks for the answers. Any suggestions for where to get the work done in the North West?

Ninemeister, Warrington. Tech9, Liverpool.
I have found a brilliant one man band in Adlington, nr. Chorley, he gets some really exotic cars in. (PM me for details)
Unit 11, Warrington if they are still going.

Hi Endoman

Good to see a fellow Boltonian on here.

PM sent.

Thanks for the info.
Regards

 

[2oldn2slow]

993 Targa - Back on the road at last - more advice please

All

Further to the posts and replies below, I would like to update on progress and also ask for more advice. As a summary of where I am now, I am exporting my 993 from the UK to France and it needs to be converted from the M150 option (leaded fuel only for Arab states) to the OEM porsche original european standard at the time of build - 1995. I have 2 options:-

Opt 1 - Get the conversion work done by Porsche which will enable me to get a full CofC from Porsche which should make registration in France fairly simple.

Opt 2 - Get the work done myself for which I have prices and sourced parts and can be done at a reasonable cost but the issue with this option is that it has to go through what is known as a DRIRE test in France which is a real unknown quantity and I am being put off by this.

Option 1 therefore is a preferred option but having contacted Porsche, my car has the Bischoff exhaust and the CAT is no longer available therefore Porsche have said to do this work they need to convert it to a Gillet exhaust system and I am sure you can all guess what that will cost !

So I am stuck now with a quandry as follows:-

Opt 1a - fit an aftermarket CAT then get the rest of the work done by Porsche - not sure if Porsche France will give me a CofC if I go this route as its all about originality - crazy but thats how it is - I have asked them the question.

Opt 1b - fit a 2nd hand Bischoff cat or get the CAT that is on there refurbished then the lambda, wiring work and setup by Porsche UK - seems a good option but again - a) will Porsche UK give me enough paperwork to confirm it is all as per original Porsche and b) will Porsche France accept this and issue a CofC. I am talking to them both to try to get this approved.

Opt 1c is to fit a 2nd hand Gillet exhaust system then take it into Porsche UK and have them fit the Lambda sensor, do the wiring, setup the car and then if necessary fit a new CAT but hopefully not.

There is also a question of whether Porsche France will accept work by Porsche UK - they should of course but who knows - I have also asked this question. I also asked Porsche France for quotes for the work but no reply yet.

So my question to the experts here is what is required to convert from a Bischoff to a Gillet cat

Mufflers - Y
CAT - Y
Heat exchangers - ?????
Heat shields - ?????
Any other parts - ?????

Anybody happen to have a gillet system in their garage that they no longer want .

All help / input appreciated, thanks

 

[decgraham]

Hi,

I know that we've been in touch regarding this issue as I had to do the same to register my car in Spain. One thing I'm not sure if I mentioned was Spain had the same rule for a personal import as the UK in so much that if you got a letter from Porsche saying this was how the car was built they would test at pre CAT emission levels. In Spain this rule only allowed for cars built up to the 31st December 1994. My car is July 1995 so I just missed out. Just wondered if France have something similar but hopefully goes beyond 31st December 1994 :?:

If the original CAT is in good shape get it refurbished by Gert. I bought an after market CAT from "Cats4U and its still going strong after 10 years :thumb:

I have a Porsche Tech Doc which shows the Bischoff / Gillet conversion kit but it's too big to upload. If I didn't send it to you and you would like a copy just PM me with your email address and I'll send it.

Good luck getting the job done, as you know it's doable :thumb:

ATB

 

[2oldn2slow]

M150 exhaust conversion

Hi

Thanks for the reply and all the info you sent me before is very useful, I haven't done much about it so far but we are getting to the point where I can start to move forwards with it.

Sadly the letter exempting the emissions testing is not available in France.

PM sent regarding the Bischoff/Gillet conversion.

At the moment I think I am going down the route of having the existing CAT refurbished and have been in touch with Gert although I need to see what the shipping costs are.

By keeping the original CAT and refurbishing it, it will be as close to original as I can get it which is key in France to either getting the full cofc from Porsche France or getting it through a DRIRE test so its my preferred route rathenrthan an aftermarket cat.

So my next step is to get Porsche France to accept a refurbished CAT is okay and if they do, then I need Porsche France to accept the wiring work being done by Porsche UK so I can get the work done in the UK before bringing the car over and registering it here.

All good fun but I will get there!

Regards

 

[decgraham]

Hi,

When the CAT is refurbished it will look fine which is not the issue with emissions, it will be what it delivers when tested. Mine went from 1.3% CO no CAT to 0.03% at tick over and 0.00% CO at speed with the CAT, all just fine.
Not sure if Porsche UK will just fit new wires for you within the original loom or fit a new rear loom, part number 99361217326 which when I looked back in 2010 was 850 quid + VAT and delivery. You could look at a second hand one which would obviously be cheaper, if you can find one. I did have a quote from Douglas Valley Breakers at the time for 350 quid + VAT and delivery and they did have one. But as we all know, Porsche tax has been applied to everything for our 993's now so no idea what the price might be now.

ATB

 

[Private Pike]

When you bring the car to France do you own a house ? You will be required to register the vehicle to that house and hold a valid French driving license to drive the vehicle and insure, many changes here in France. Drier I have visited be prepared for a bill anything up €3000 for so called modified / non conforming vehicles, messy all the best where you living in France ?

We're based in Provence South of France 83