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kevinbuckley70
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Joined: 27 Dec 2013
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 27, 2013 2:04 am    Post subject: Ridiculous question pondered many times ... Reply with quote

Yes, I know, I know ...

Never owned a Porsche. Middle age crisis looming. £25k to waste. Ongoing costs not a problem.

Want a 911, not a cabriolet. Must look cool. Red. Younger than 2005.

Has to be reliable though.

What?
 
  
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kas750
Shanghai


Joined: 31 Mar 2013
Posts: 4650
Location: Chorley lancashire

2006 Porsche 911

PostPosted: Fri Dec 27, 2013 8:55 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

That will be one of these then. Very Happy
 
  
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kevinbuckley70
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Joined: 27 Dec 2013
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 27, 2013 9:04 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

That is certainly very pretty! I read on here that the 996 (and others) are considered to be 'real' Porches, whereas the Cayman is not. Why is that?
 
  
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clarkycat
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Joined: 11 May 2011
Posts: 3902
Location: Oxfordshire


PostPosted: Fri Dec 27, 2013 9:10 am    Post subject: Re: Ridiculous question pondered many times ... Reply with quote

kevinbuckley70 wrote:
£25k to waste. Ongoing costs not a problem.


Don't get a 993.

It will always be worth more than you paid for it, and it won't have any ongoing costs or nasty surprises.
nooo
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T8
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Joined: 29 Jun 2010
Posts: 16298
Location: Kent


PostPosted: Fri Dec 27, 2013 9:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

kevinbuckley70 wrote:
That is certainly very pretty! I read on here that the 996 (and others) are considered to be 'real' Porches, whereas the Cayman is not. Why is that?


Welcome Kevin,

The Cayman IS a real Porsche but it's not a 911.

If you want a Porsche, £25k will get you into some really nice Caymans or an early 997 with good provenance.

There are very few 2005 996s around and a Turbo of that age will be a bit over your £25k budget.

Happy Hunting. bye
_________________
2007 Guards Red 997 Turbo Tiptronic
ex 2004 Polar Silver 996T Tiptronic
ex 2002 Seal Grey 996.2 C4 Tiptronic
ex 1978 Silver 924 Manual
 
  
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kevinbuckley70
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Joined: 27 Dec 2013
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 28, 2013 1:14 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Really dumb question I'm sure, but ...

So is a Cayman not a 911 simply because Porsche say so on the badge?

Or is there a fundamental difference between, say, a 996 and a Cayman?

More so than the difference between a 993 and a 996 for example.
 
  
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T8
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 28, 2013 6:25 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

kevinbuckley70 wrote:
Really dumb question I'm sure, but ...

So is a Cayman not a 911 simply because Porsche say so on the badge?

Or is there a fundamental difference between, say, a 996 and a Cayman?

More so than the difference between a 993 and a 996 for example.


Dumb Question ................. probably

The Porsche 911 has always had its engine in the rear and can be 2wd or 4wd, Coupe or Cabriolet, normally aspirated or turbocharged. It also has rear seats. A 993 and a 996 are just different model incarnations of the 911.

The Cayman is a mid-engined, 2wd, 2-seater, normally aspirated Coupe also made by Porsche.

Asking why a Cayman isn't a 911 is like asking why a Ford Fiesta isn't a Ford Focus. In fact, it's worse as the Fiesta and Focus both have 4/5 seats, have their engines in the same place and, iirc, even share the same engines.
_________________
2007 Guards Red 997 Turbo Tiptronic
ex 2004 Polar Silver 996T Tiptronic
ex 2002 Seal Grey 996.2 C4 Tiptronic
ex 1978 Silver 924 Manual
 
  
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kevinbuckley70
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Joined: 27 Dec 2013
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 28, 2013 11:17 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks, that was helpful, as was your earlier response.

I am wondering if it might be better not to spend right up to the budget, and get something like a well maintained 2003 C4S which, it seems, I can do for around £17k - £21k, and keep something in the bank to fix issues.

I just sold my 2001, Mercedes E320, which I had for many years, and kept well serviced and maintained. However, latterly, it was falling to pieces and rusting faster than I was prepared to fix it, so it had to go (although that variant is well known for certain issues).

Whilst managing maintenance costs is not such a problem, I don't want a car which is forever in the shop, or lets me down. So a question is: is a 2003 996 likely to be much (or any) less reliable than an early 997?

Does the 996 have any well known body/corrosion issues which are going to become a major problem in a 10yr old car?
 
  
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T8
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 28, 2013 11:43 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

You should get into a very good 996 C4S for under £20k. An early 997 with similar miles would cost you a few £k more.

As with any car age hurts consumable components so like-for-like a car 2 or 3 years newer will probably cost a bit less to get up to scratch/maintain. The engines in the 996C4S and the early 997s are fundamentally the same but both have known potential issues. Neither will give any concerns re body rust - unless they've been pranged and repaired.

Take your time. Decide whether you'd prefer to spend a bit more for the newer 997 and then the exciting bit really starts. Thumb
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ex 2004 Polar Silver 996T Tiptronic
ex 2002 Seal Grey 996.2 C4 Tiptronic
ex 1978 Silver 924 Manual
 
  
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kevinbuckley70
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 28, 2013 11:54 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

T8 wrote:
You should get into a very good 996 C4S for under £20k. An early 997 with similar miles would cost you a few £k more.


Would I have to compromise anything in terms of interior spec. if I went for a 997 which, at around £25k, seems to be the very bottom of the price range, compared with spending £20k on a 996?

When I bought the Merc., the first thing I did was give it to a specialist independent guy I know very well, who spent a week fixing or replacing everything which was dubious. I am inclined to think I should do the same thing with this purchase.
 
  
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T8
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 28, 2013 2:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

kevinbuckley70 wrote:


Would I have to compromise anything in terms of interior spec. if I went for a 997 which, at around £25k, seems to be the very bottom of the price range, compared with spending £20k on a 996?



It very much depends on how much of your budget you want to spend and how much you prefer the 997 over the 996.

For £20k-£23k I'd want a late (early 04) 996, well spec'd and with lowish miles and with a dealer warranty.

These days £23k would get a 997 (04-06 according to spec and miles) from a dealer. There seem to be a lot of that age with sensible mileage (60k ish) around at the moment. Decide what options you particularly want and it shouldn't be difficult to narrow the field a bit.

With a full £25k you'd be really spoilt for choice. Thumb

Unfortunately you'd then also start seeing the odd 'S' with the 3.8 engine and a whole new quandary would begin. Grin
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ex 2004 Polar Silver 996T Tiptronic
ex 2002 Seal Grey 996.2 C4 Tiptronic
ex 1978 Silver 924 Manual
 
  
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kevinbuckley70
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Joined: 27 Dec 2013
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 28, 2013 2:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

T8 wrote:
... 996, well spec'd and with lowish miles and with a dealer warranty.


I assume you mean independent dealers? If I went down the dealer route, would you recommend also getting a separate independent inspection? Or are dealers to be trusted?
 
  
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T8
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 28, 2013 2:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

kevinbuckley70 wrote:
T8 wrote:
... 996, well spec'd and with lowish miles and with a dealer warranty.


I assume you mean independent dealers? If I went down the dealer route, would you recommend also getting a separate independent inspection? Or are dealers to be trusted?


Yes, sorry. You wouldn't find a £25k car at an OPC.

If buying from a non-Porsche dealer or one claiming to be a 'specialist' I'd definitely get a PPI and look very carefully at any restrictions in the wording of their warranty.

If buying from one of the specialists that advertise on here (& a few that don't) the car and the warranty should both be ok.
_________________
2007 Guards Red 997 Turbo Tiptronic
ex 2004 Polar Silver 996T Tiptronic
ex 2002 Seal Grey 996.2 C4 Tiptronic
ex 1978 Silver 924 Manual
 
  
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kevinbuckley70
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Joined: 27 Dec 2013
Posts: 60



PostPosted: Sat Dec 28, 2013 2:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

That's great, thanks. I think it's time to go look & drive!

I actually quite like the look of the 996. But I guess until you see/drive for real, it's hard to tell.

Smile
 
  
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Kimbo
Paul Ricard


Joined: 05 May 2011
Posts: 3480
Location: East Sussex


PostPosted: Sat Dec 28, 2013 3:03 pm    Post subject: Re: Ridiculous question pondered many times ... Reply with quote

clarkycat wrote:
it won't have any ongoing costs or nasty surprises.
nooo


Bit early to be pissed isn't it?
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Zingari
Brands Hatch
Brands Hatch


Joined: 25 Oct 2009
Posts: 13151
Location: Cheshire

1993 Porsche 964 Anniversary

PostPosted: Sat Dec 28, 2013 3:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

If you dont get a 996 Turbo then I'd get a 997 as the quality of trim is far superior to a stock 996.

Turbo is unbelievable performance for the price plus it has the solid engine and not made out of plastic like some seem to be when bore score attacks cylinder no6 nooo 997.1 can suffer a similar fate so go in with your eyes open and if you want reassurance get it on a maintenance plan. Mileage is not a factor for these engine problems - its more a question of bad luck.

(For a balanced view - most don't go pop, we mainly hear about the ones that do which is enough for me if I were to buy a one it would be on a plan. But then again the only 996 for me would be turbo or GT3 Grin )
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kevinbuckley70
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Joined: 27 Dec 2013
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 28, 2013 5:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I would probably go with a maintenance plan in any case. The one by Hartech looks pretty good although I haven't looked around yet. Location could be an issue though - my permanent base is near Oxford but I am currently full time in Edinburgh, for a few months anyway.

The 996 turbo is too close to my budget limit for comfort. Maybe that can be my next upgrade! And this car has to work reliably as it will be my workhorse, not a toy (or as well as a toy ...).

Does the trim in the bottom of the price range, early 997 exceed the quality of the trim in a late 996 at around £20k?

I heard the 996 & 997.1 engines are similar (same?) - do they have the same potential issues? Or is the late 996 (non-turbo) engine better than the 997.1 engine?

Do they have the same service/oil change schedule?
 
  
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Zingari
Brands Hatch
Brands Hatch


Joined: 25 Oct 2009
Posts: 13151
Location: Cheshire

1993 Porsche 964 Anniversary

PostPosted: Sat Dec 28, 2013 11:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

AFAIK the late 996 and 997.1 engine are the same. I think 2yr service plan only came in with 997.

The quality of fittings in 996 and 997 is night and day as it was a total refresh with no obvious carry over. 997.2 is better still but then you're into big money.

I'd aim for a C4S on your budget, or if you only need two seats I'd go for a well specc'd CaymanS
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kevinbuckley70
Trainee


Joined: 27 Dec 2013
Posts: 60



PostPosted: Sun Dec 29, 2013 12:35 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I quite like the look of the 996 C4S. So I guess a big question is: is it better to get a good, late 996 near the top of the price bracket (and maybe with money to spare, just in case), or a very early 997.1 at the bottom, on the limit of my budget?
 
  
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kevinbuckley70
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Joined: 27 Dec 2013
Posts: 60



PostPosted: Sun Dec 29, 2013 1:22 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Also, I am going to be working in Edinburgh for a while - can anyone recommend an independent dealer in that region? From what I can see, they mostly seem to be in the South.
 
  
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