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samba-lee
Suzuka


Joined: 19 Aug 2008
Posts: 1050
Location: Manchester

1974 Lamborghini urraco

PostPosted: Mon Jun 20, 2011 5:20 pm    Post subject: Windscreen scuttle corner repair thread. Reply with quote

OCD'ers beware - this is advanced warning not to read on!

As promised this is the start of my windscreen scuttle repair thread. It all started last week when I had something hit the windscreen resulting in a crack.

National windscreens are doing the screen fitting via insurance and came round this morning to remove the old glass.

I was aware of rust in the corners and expected more besides. Here's what I found.

First picture, showing relatively nice looking scuttle panel, outer seal removed.

Second and third pictures: screen removed showing the extent of the rust as expected.

Forth picture is the problem as you can see where the glue was missed or there was a bubble or open cavity in the glue it has rusted. There was several of these along the bottom edge. So sorry guys this is clearly a factory install issue and it goes unseen until you remove the screen.

Now next post will be the rust removal and welding! Surprised I had to do so I shall keep you in suspense until then...
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schwarz993
Watkins Glen


Joined: 09 Jul 2008
Posts: 2063
Location: London

1996 Porsche 993 Carrera 2

PostPosted: Mon Jun 20, 2011 5:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Scary Surprised


Good luck.
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dommorton
Zolder


Joined: 16 Mar 2008
Posts: 5062


1998 Porsche 993 Carrera 4S

PostPosted: Mon Jun 20, 2011 5:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yikes! It ain't pretty is it.

Mine's been done before, but I would like a new screen due to some annoying small chips. I'm hoping the job that was done was a good one, and that there are no nasties hiding underneath. I do think that is perhaps a little over optimistic.
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samba-lee
Suzuka


Joined: 19 Aug 2008
Posts: 1050
Location: Manchester

1974 Lamborghini urraco

PostPosted: Mon Jun 20, 2011 5:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Drivers side, looks pretty bad eh? well after some angle grinder wire bushing and then careful use of a grinding disc there isn't much rust left, but there was a small hole about 5mm diameter just on the turn up the A-pillar. I gave the rest of the area a real good poke with a scribe and nowhere went through.

Welded a tiny patch into the hole and ground it down.

Used some BiltHamber Deox magic rust stuff which is just water based and have left it in the corner and will remove it over night. You can see this stuff visible eating the rust away.
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dommorton
Zolder


Joined: 16 Mar 2008
Posts: 5062


1998 Porsche 993 Carrera 4S

PostPosted: Mon Jun 20, 2011 5:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Can you get to the other side of the panel to put rust prevention in place?
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samba-lee
Suzuka


Joined: 19 Aug 2008
Posts: 1050
Location: Manchester

1974 Lamborghini urraco

PostPosted: Mon Jun 20, 2011 5:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

dommorton wrote:
Can you get to the other side of the panel to put rust prevention in place?


Yep, it's not visible but I had my finger on the back of the little hole that needed welding so getting the waxoyl nozzle up there will be no problem and there was no apparent rust at all on the backside of the panel - it was nice and smooth (apart from there the hole was).

The panel repair will easily last another 15 years.

I'll first be painting it with BRUNOX epoxy anti rust primer then sneak in a very localised paint repair which despite the amount of rust will be almost invisible when the out trim seal it fitted.

Lee
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dommorton
Zolder


Joined: 16 Mar 2008
Posts: 5062


1998 Porsche 993 Carrera 4S

PostPosted: Mon Jun 20, 2011 6:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ah good stuff Thumb
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samba-lee
Suzuka


Joined: 19 Aug 2008
Posts: 1050
Location: Manchester

1974 Lamborghini urraco

PostPosted: Mon Jun 20, 2011 6:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Passenger side.

Picture 1: Urgh.

Picture 2: a quick scrape and it looks a bit better.

Picture 3: Angle grinder + wire brush and a good poke revealed a couple of small holes (3/4 mm)

Picture 4: Cut the holes out to thicker metal

Picture 5: Patch welded in and ground back. Job done.

Windscreen scuttle rust removed diy. Cost: £very little.

Next, final wire brush after I remove the Deox then Epoxy anti rust.
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Zuffenhausen :O)
Sepang


Joined: 15 Mar 2009
Posts: 2848
Location: Hampshire


PostPosted: Mon Jun 20, 2011 8:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Surprised



Get thee behind me Satan! Good grief Lee you have been in the wars with the tin worm in your 993, cracking job though!
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ballcock
Sepang


Joined: 21 Jul 2008
Posts: 2969
Location: Dublin

1996 Porsche 993 Carrera 2

PostPosted: Tue Jun 21, 2011 10:03 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Brilliant thread Lee ,
No doubt that all untreated 993s look like this under the screen , it just NEEDS to be done frustrated

Well done on doing all the work yourself , and good news that the underside of the frame isn't affected.

Have you thought about sealing/waxing between the screen and the scuttle once the screen is back in?
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Tony 991S
Imola


Joined: 27 Nov 2010
Posts: 819



PostPosted: Tue Jun 21, 2011 10:07 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Good thread OP Thumb
 
  
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samba-lee
Suzuka


Joined: 19 Aug 2008
Posts: 1050
Location: Manchester

1974 Lamborghini urraco

PostPosted: Tue Jun 21, 2011 10:07 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The rust along the middle section cleaned up easily.

I tell you unless a 993 has had this job done then I guarantee there will be rust.

The windscreen guy removed the old screen without much trouble and didn't break it, so it's almost worth removing it to investigate.

Given what I know now:

1) where ever windscreen glue has been applied properly there are no issues.

2) filling the groove with either windscreen glue or sealant as we have all discussed would prevent this, but would need to be inspected to ensure it is still well bonded. Any dirt in the groove would render the sealant useless. also not sure how it would bond onto the ptfe tape. Question

Lee
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ballcock
Sepang


Joined: 21 Jul 2008
Posts: 2969
Location: Dublin

1996 Porsche 993 Carrera 2

PostPosted: Tue Jun 21, 2011 12:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

What about filling the crevace with wurth anti rust or similar..
This stuff hardens to a candle like wax consistency ,would keep pooling of water at bay and would fight any rust if it appeared underneath.
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samba-lee
Suzuka


Joined: 19 Aug 2008
Posts: 1050
Location: Manchester

1974 Lamborghini urraco

PostPosted: Tue Jun 21, 2011 4:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

ballcock wrote:
What about filling the crevace with wurth anti rust or similar..
This stuff hardens to a candle like wax consistency ,would keep pooling of water at bay and would fight any rust if it appeared underneath.


Maybe, although it the screen moves a little, the Wurth would probably not. I think a flexible sealant as Porsche recommended or even windscreen glue which is pretty much the same thing.

Lee
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Zingari
Donnington
Donnington


Joined: 25 Oct 2009
Posts: 12880
Location: Cheshire

1993 Porsche 964 Anniversary

PostPosted: Tue Jun 21, 2011 6:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Top work Lee Thumb
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cyruspower
Paul Ricard


Joined: 30 Jul 2009
Posts: 3461


1996 Porsche 993 Carrera 2

PostPosted: Tue Jun 21, 2011 6:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Wow Lee, you truly have balls of steel and they probably aren't rusty either.

Mine was very similar around the rear screen, with the rubber and sealant hiding a nightmare beneath.

993s are at the age where it might be sensible to have the front and rear screens out as a precaution to check, whether there's visible rust or not.

If I was in the market to buy another one, I'd want to know it's been looked at already (ideally with photographic evidence), to be on the safe side.

Same goes for the chassis rails......
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samba-lee
Suzuka


Joined: 19 Aug 2008
Posts: 1050
Location: Manchester

1974 Lamborghini urraco

PostPosted: Tue Jun 21, 2011 7:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

cyruspower wrote:
Wow Lee, you truly have balls of steel and they probably aren't rusty either.

Mine was very similar around the rear screen, with the rubber and sealant hiding a nightmare beneath.

993s are at the age where it might be sensible to have the front and rear screens out as a precaution to check, whether there's visible rust or not.

If I was in the market to buy another one, I'd want to know it's been looked at already (ideally with photographic evidence), to be on the safe side.

Same goes for the chassis rails......


Absolutely. The windscreen guy had the screen out in just a few minutes although the removal tool does leave some scratches inside the aperture. They are used to this and have a special quick drying black primer they use to protect the aperture before refitting.

I'm interested in a few C4S's and at those prices I would be examining the screen areas very closely.

Lee
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samba-lee
Suzuka


Joined: 19 Aug 2008
Posts: 1050
Location: Manchester

1974 Lamborghini urraco

PostPosted: Tue Jun 21, 2011 7:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Just finished about two hours removing the ptfe tape.

Tip: be very careful when removing the tape and try and do it in one go (or stages). There were some sections on the drivers A pillar which left a small strip about 2mm wide and about 10cm long - this last bit took me literally an hour to remove. It's heatproof, solvent proof, scrape proof (with a soft implement). I ended up very carefully using a scraper on it until I could feel the smoothness of the paint underneath - I didn't scratch the paint at all.

Then run round where the tape was with some G3 cutting polish and it's like new from corner to corner all around the top of the frame.

Once I've finished the bottom and corners I'll put new tape all around - it's only about 8mm wide and just sits right on the rounded corner of the windscreen pressing so you could easily fit it with the screen in.

Lee
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tmilligan
Barcelona


Joined: 04 Sep 2009
Posts: 1404
Location: London / Gloucestershire / Isle of Wight


PostPosted: Tue Jun 21, 2011 8:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

What I find scariest about this is just how bad the rust can be with barely any sign externally. If I were buying a car now I'd be very wary of one which hadn't been checked fairly recently...

Some of you saw my 4S at Waddesdon and will have seen that the paint looked pretty good around the screen. There was just what looked to be the beginnings of bubbling. Well, it's been off at OPC Byfleet having lots and lots done, including a new front screen and some attention to the rust. I will post pictures when I am near a proper computer, but suffice to say when the screen came out it was pretty ugly. After some deliberation I bit the bullet and chose rather than a patch up to go for a new front scuttle panel. I want to start from scratch and will be keeping a VERY close eye on moisture under the screen...
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987.1 2.7; 356 Speedster, Golf GT TDi DSG
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AAT993
Nürburgring


Joined: 26 Oct 2008
Posts: 468
Location: Surrey

1996 Porsche 993 Targa

PostPosted: Tue Jun 21, 2011 11:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Lee

Great post. Scary stuff indeed. Surprised Mine has some small bubbling around the screen, and now I dread of what may (almost surely) lies beneath. Will I be able to wait until the end of the summer before getting this looked at? Dont know

Thanks again for a great thread, even if part of me wishes I hadn't! Thumb
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