Difference between standard and x51 oil sump

MisterCorn · 13 Dec 2019

I knew that there was a difference, but I'd never really had a good look at them side-by-side to what it actually is, and how these differences will affect performance. Until now.

Standard sump on the left, x51 on the right. Nothig the different material used an the shapes of the baffles.

At the front of the engine, the x51 is sealed against the crank case with rubber flaps, whilst the standard supm relies on a small riser in the centre of the sump to reduce the space for oil to flow through from one side to the other.

When fitted in an engine block you can see the gaps here.

With the baffles removed from the sump it is easy to see how effective the x51 sealing is. It does a much better job of creating three partitions in the sump. The centre section where the oil from the block mostly returns to, and a pair of side sections where the head scavenges return to.

On the standard sump it is relatively easy for oil to move from one side to the other, with the x51 baffles the oil is much more likely to end up in the centre section. The centre section is also larger capacity.

MC

maldren · 13 Dec 2019

Interesting how 'home made' the X51 sump looks compared with the production item which show cost control with pressed metal and spot welds and rivets(?)

DynoMike · 13 Dec 2019

maldren said:
Interesting how 'home made' the X51 sump looks compared with the production item which show cost control with pressed metal and spot welds and rivets(?)

My thoughts exactly, Mike.

MisterCorn · 13 Dec 2019

Yes it is clearly not mass produced by any means. No welding, just rivets, bent bits of aluminium, and nuts and bolts. A very nice design though IMO and a very clear advantage over the standard item. More details in the video here:

MC

Glasgow 911SC · 13 Dec 2019

Are either (or both - my assumption) what Porsche referred to as their "integrated dry sump"?

MisterCorn · 13 Dec 2019

Glasgow 911SC said:
Are either (or both - my assumption) what Porsche referred to as their "integrated dry sump"?

Yes. A dry sump is where you use scavenge pumps to remove oil to a tank, then pick up the oil from there to feed to the engine. These engines use a pair of scavenge pumps in the heads to return oil to the sump. The differences to a proper dry sump are that the block itself isn't scavenged, so doesn't run signuficantly below atmospheric pressure, and due to the shape of the sump it is not the tall and narrow shape which would be ideal for an oil tank. The integrated dry sump is a good bit of marketting speak IMO. When running a flat engine you will need to scavenge the heads somehow.

MC

DarthFaker · 14 Dec 2019

MisterCorn said:
Yes it is clearly not mass produced by any means. No welding, just rivets, bent bits of aluminium, and nuts and bolts. A very nice design though IMO and a very clear advantage over the standard item. More details in the video here:

MC

Well it originally designed a a possibility instead of the Mezger engine the X51, it was the backup engine which may have been used in some race series but never did. So the kind of nut and bolt construction makes sense, motorsport has never cared for making it pretty.

coullstar · 14 Dec 2019

Are these still available from main dealer?

MisterCorn · 14 Dec 2019

coullstar said:
Are these still available from main dealer?

Yes they are. 99610724341 A couple of hundred £. Aftermarket baffle kits are available for a bit less, which are basically just a copy of this.

MC

jerzybondov · 14 Dec 2019

How different is the sump in the 3.6 X51? Am I correct in thinking the two X51 conversions (3.4 vs 3.6) were quite different?

Dammit · 14 Dec 2019

3.4 and 3.6 sumps are identical, but there are other differences- a lot of the stock stuff that was changed on the 3.4 was retained on the 3.6.

infrasilver · 14 Dec 2019

I compared the two a few years ago and was going to copy the design for my own sump but never got around to it. It looked a very easy job to replicate with some ally sheet and tin snips.

GrafZero · 6 Aug 2023

I decided to replace my standard oil sump with the X51 one and interestingly, it's slightly different than the one from pictures in the first post - seems a bit simplified.

MisterCorn · 7 Aug 2023

Looks the same to me.

MC

GrafZero · 7 Aug 2023

The upper edges of the "walls" ale less "jagged" on mine", they are mostly straight. It's a very minor difference.

Difference between standard and x51 oil sump

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