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NedHan79
Hockenheim


Joined: 08 Nov 2018
Posts: 713



PostPosted: Thu Nov 21, 2019 10:05 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Martin996RSR wrote:
We don't have a secondary air pump on UK market 996.1 cars.


That’s my confusion sorted Thumb
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NedHan79
Hockenheim


Joined: 08 Nov 2018
Posts: 713



PostPosted: Sun Nov 24, 2019 6:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Just bought a trw ps pump on eBay so it looks like the frunk mounted ps is going to happen. Had been trying to buy a few on eBay but no one wants to post to Northern Ireland due to extra cost. One has gotten back to me so I’ll need to sort out the pipes of anyone can help.

On the seats, I’m unsure. My contact got back to me with all the details of his but they were weighing in at 11.5kg so not worth the bother.
I might leave the seats and concentrate on the rest of the refresh and sorting the suspension, then paint etc. I’d like to actually get using the car at some stage
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GMG
Nürburgring


Joined: 07 Jan 2018
Posts: 478
Location: Devon


PostPosted: Mon Nov 25, 2019 6:56 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

...I removed the rear wiper and saved 2 kg of weight and I can feel the difference in performance... Floor
 
  
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sim996
Monza


Joined: 05 Aug 2017
Posts: 233



PostPosted: Mon Nov 25, 2019 8:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

NedHan79 wrote:
Just bought a trw ps pump on eBay so it looks like the frunk mounted ps is going to happen. Had been trying to buy a few on eBay but no one wants to post to Northern Ireland due to extra cost. One has gotten back to me so I’ll need to sort out the pipes of anyone can help.

On the seats, I’m unsure. My contact got back to me with all the details of his but they were weighing in at 11.5kg so not worth the bother.
I might leave the seats and concentrate on the rest of the refresh and sorting the suspension, then paint etc. I’d like to actually get using the car at some stage


Pics of pump? Where will you mount it?
 
  
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maldren
Suzuka


Joined: 07 Oct 2016
Posts: 1237



PostPosted: Mon Nov 25, 2019 10:03 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

GMG wrote:
...I removed the rear wiper and saved 2 kg of weight and I can feel the difference in performance... Floor


Perhaps it was the reduced drag rather than the weight reduction?!?!?
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Mike
2003 996.2 C2 Coupe Arctic Silver
 
  
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NedHan79
Hockenheim


Joined: 08 Nov 2018
Posts: 713



PostPosted: Mon Nov 25, 2019 11:06 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sim996 I haven’t got the pump yet so can’t help on that one. I’ll mount it in the frunk but I’m not sure yet on position as I need to sort out the pipes first
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Martin996RSR
Nürburgring


Joined: 08 Dec 2016
Posts: 462



PostPosted: Mon Nov 25, 2019 4:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

GMG, I tried to give context in terms of my skill set/experience and that others weren't likely to notice the difference but you're still falling into the trap of judging others by your own capabilities rather than theirs. You're also taking the rather unedifying step of quoting someone and then adding words that I didn't write. I stated I could notice a difference, not that there was any perceptible difference in performance.
 
  
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GMG
Nürburgring


Joined: 07 Jan 2018
Posts: 478
Location: Devon


PostPosted: Mon Nov 25, 2019 5:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

...if you believe that you noticed a difference of 2 kg then you must have magical powers, which of course you don't and neither could you or anyone notice such a trace change on a car weighing close to 1400kg with driver and fuel...
 
  
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MisterCorn
Dijon


Joined: 08 Jan 2011
Posts: 7462
Location: Nottingham, England

2004 Porsche 996 Turbo

PostPosted: Mon Nov 25, 2019 5:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Martin996RSR wrote:
We don't have a secondary air pump on UK market 996.1 cars.


Or at least we didn't have, until the 2000 MY cars were introduced.
My C4, registered Jun 2001 certainly has one.

MC
 
  
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NedHan79
Hockenheim


Joined: 08 Nov 2018
Posts: 713



PostPosted: Mon Nov 25, 2019 6:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Now now boys. I’m only looking for a little info on weather or not to bother with the diet, it a slagging match.

As I said, I’ve a pump bought on eBay but not here yet. I can’t get out to the garage atm anyway so I’m only really doing my homework. I’ve been concentrating on another part of the car to be renewed and improved.

There’s always something Very Happy
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Martin996RSR
Nürburgring


Joined: 08 Dec 2016
Posts: 462



PostPosted: Mon Nov 25, 2019 6:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sorry Ned, it just grips my ***** when people who think they know better try to make their point with rofl smilies rather than reasoned arguments.

CMG, it's not magical powers, simply obsessive attention to detail, several decades of driving, racing, developing race cars and road cars and test driving them on road and track, as well as doing the wiper before/after test drives about 45 minutes apart, meaning my baseline was very recent. Had it been a gap of a day or two then I probably wouldn't have noticed anything. If this is too far fetched a notion for you to grapple with then I suggest you just try to move on.
 
  
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NedHan79
Hockenheim


Joined: 08 Nov 2018
Posts: 713



PostPosted: Mon Nov 25, 2019 9:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

No call for apologies Martin. It dosnt bother me
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NedHan79
Hockenheim


Joined: 08 Nov 2018
Posts: 713



PostPosted: Fri Nov 29, 2019 9:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Just had a quick google and my current battery is HEAVY Surprised
It’s a Yuasa 3017 which weighs in at 21.2kg so a decent saving to be had there.

Also my power steering pump has landed so I’m very keen to hear advice from those who have fitted them. I could definitely do with some pointers to get it right first time
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NedHan79
Hockenheim


Joined: 08 Nov 2018
Posts: 713



PostPosted: Sun Dec 15, 2019 11:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I’ve done some updates on the power steering pump on the other thread if anyone wants to know.


I now have a random thought.
I see “muffler deletes” on google all the time. This has to be a significant weight loss. I have aftermarket stuff in already but thought about whipping the silencers out. Obviously this would be seriously loud and there’s the power loss issue that people all claim. Noise aside, would the weight difference be enough to offset the power loss?

If I was to try this, I’d just be making my own pipes but I’m thinking of something with a bike style end can straight through silencer, albeit Avery short one or, removing the cats and fitting this type of silencer in their place.

This is obviously only a random idea but it’s one that’s an easy option to make. I’m not keen on the no silencer route as in the “muffler delete “ purely for noise as I find the cars plenty loud enough now. FYI I ready have a full stainless steel exhaust including cars and headers.
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Martin996RSR
Nürburgring


Joined: 08 Dec 2016
Posts: 462



PostPosted: Mon Dec 16, 2019 7:23 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

No silencer on any four stroke engine adds power in comparison to having a straight pipe. Anyone who says different is simply wrong. Silencers/mufflers work by using baffles and perforated pipes to modify and take energy out of the exhaust pulses to make them quieter. Taking energy (kinetic) out of the exhaust flow slows it down and reduces the efficiency of the system. If mufflers added power then you would see them on top fuel dragsters instead of the open pipes they use.

The shorter and the straighter you make the exhaust, the lower the losses will be. The other important factor is the pipe diameter which should be sized for maximum gas speed at the point in the rev range where you want maximum torque to be. If the pipe is too big then the gas will slow down and if it's too small the flow will become choked.

I've tried running my car with just the manifolds on and it would wake the dead. Unless you really don't expect to encounter other human beings whilst the car is running then I recommend using some form of silencer.

I think the best power/weight compromise for the 996 hasn't yet been made, but it would be a variation on the Afterhours Automotive idea. This uses straight through mufflers on each side. This does away with baffles and will conserve energy in the exhaust gas at the expense of still being very loud. I think a variation on this that has the cat and muffler on a pipe run that keeps the exhaust for each bank on the same side and does away with the pipes running across the back of the car would be lighter and have less losses.

You would need to keep the bend radii in the exhaust to the absolute maximum that the packaging allows, as bends also hurt exhaust efficiency. Anyway, this arrangement would probably give fewer losses and weigh many KG less than any other 996 exhaust out there. I would expect a reasonable home welder such as yourself to be able to knock such an exhaust up from off the shelf parts for around £600, or even less if you recylced parts from your old exhaust.
 
  
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Martin996RSR
Nürburgring


Joined: 08 Dec 2016
Posts: 462



PostPosted: Mon Dec 16, 2019 7:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Here is a link to a PH thread that discusses this a little more:
https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&f=48&t=1286676

Also, if anyone ever uses the word 'backpressure' to you, just kick them in the balls and walk away.
 
  
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NedHan79
Hockenheim


Joined: 08 Nov 2018
Posts: 713



PostPosted: Mon Dec 16, 2019 9:06 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Some valid points there Martin. For some reason I can’t seem to open the pistonheads thread but I get the idea. I had been thinking of something like removing the cats and rear boxes, and knocking up a couple of “cheap” eBay type straight through silencers. I was thinking of just running them across the rear as per standard stuff but now I’m thinking it’d be possible to have 2 short ones at each side. A pipe coming from the manifold, then a u bend, then a short silencer, another U bend leading to another silencer and out through the bumper. All small for packaging reasons. Another option is to go centre exit. I must get the tape out and look to see what possible. This is all hypothetical as I’ve a big list of jobs before I get that far
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Last edited by NedHan79 on Mon Dec 16, 2019 1:07 pm; edited 1 time in total
 
  
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Martin996RSR
Nürburgring


Joined: 08 Dec 2016
Posts: 462



PostPosted: Mon Dec 16, 2019 10:53 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I looked at centre exit too but decided it was going to be too much of a packaging problem to fit it all behind the rear PU and not have it overheat and blister the paintwork. I'm sure it would bear a second look though.
 
  
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Marky911
Sepang


Joined: 04 Jun 2009
Posts: 2801



PostPosted: Mon Dec 16, 2019 12:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

MartinRSR

I’m intrigued into which series you race in? 911s in particular or all sorts?
That’s if you race, or are you an engineer?
 
  
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NedHan79
Hockenheim


Joined: 08 Nov 2018
Posts: 713



PostPosted: Mon Dec 16, 2019 1:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Martin as I said I already have a full stainless system fitted and might never touch it but I’m just thinking outside the box. I’d need to get my finger out and sort the ps pump first so I can finish the front of the car and move on
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