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A993LAD
Montreal


Joined: 20 Mar 2007
Posts: 500
Location: Cambs


PostPosted: Sat Sep 01, 2018 1:56 pm    Post subject: Oil leak help needed Reply with quote

Hi guys

Took my 993 out for a blast this morning in the sunshine and once it had warmed up decided to drive it in the spirited fashion for which it was manufactured.

A quick glance in the mirrors revealed massive clouds of smoke behind the car as I was accelerating hard up the road.

I assumed the smoke was coming out of one of the exhaust pipes but thankfully not. Opening the engine cover revealed that the car is spewing out quite a bit of oil on the right hand side which is Finding its way onto the heat exchanger and the exhaust creating all of the smoke.

My problem is I'm struggling to identify where the oil is coming out of the car. There is quite a lot of oil covering everything from the filler tube all the way down the side of the engine and spread all over the chassis before eventually dripping down and sitting on the flat top of the heat exchanger.

The engine performance seems as good as ever so hopefully this is not some kind of catastrophic engine failure.

Any suggestions on where to investigate for the leak will be gratefully received.
 



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A993LAD
Montreal


Joined: 20 Mar 2007
Posts: 500
Location: Cambs


PostPosted: Sat Sep 01, 2018 2:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

It doesn't look too bad in the photos above but there is plenty of oil spread around the right hand side of the engine bay.

This photo shows the amount that carried on dripping off the heat exchanger after I park the car up.
 



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RobIpswichUK
Kyalami


Joined: 27 Aug 2010
Posts: 1983
Location: Ipswich (at a guess!)

1994 Porsche 993 Carrera 2

PostPosted: Sat Sep 01, 2018 2:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Are you sure it hasn't been overfilled? Symptoms and pics look like the oil could have come out the top of the filler neck (which it can do if overfilled).

Don't ask me how I know!! Embarassed Embarassed
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madalaa
Fuji


Joined: 13 Mar 2008
Posts: 9358
Location: West London

2009 Porsche Boxster 987

PostPosted: Sat Sep 01, 2018 3:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have had similar ....... If I remember correctly the oil filler pipe came adrift or lose ....... it made one helluva mess and I was abroad at the time on a weekend with no recourse for a garage ....... nursed it home but used a lot of oil in the process.
 
  
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HSC911
Zolder


Joined: 23 Jul 2014
Posts: 5731
Location: Bedford


PostPosted: Sat Sep 01, 2018 4:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I am sure the 996 oil pipe is the same, it's like to parts which just 'slip' into each other like a funnel sort of thing Dont know

Good luck with it and hope it's not too expensive a fix Thumb
 
  
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Pip1968
Suzuka


Joined: 26 Oct 2009
Posts: 1137
Location: Blighty


PostPosted: Sat Sep 01, 2018 5:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I had some 'loose' oil but nothing on the garage floor. Matt at Fearnsport spotted it when she went in for cage and suspension work. He did change the sender (?) but I still think it was solely the cracked (longitudal) plastic filler pipe folowing a service by a independant Porsche 'specialist' Surprised (Nowhere near me but near my friend's in Portsmouth). They manged to make a mess of that and the SSK they put in. Matt sorted it all out Thumb

The oil was seen to be around the base of the plastic filler neck and some small drips onto other metalwork below following the 100 mile trip 'tup norf' to Fearnsport.

Pip
 
  
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deMort
Zolder


Joined: 21 Mar 2015
Posts: 5563
Location: Brighton


PostPosted: Sat Sep 01, 2018 5:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

If you have had an oil change recently then its been over filled imho.
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A993LAD
Montreal


Joined: 20 Mar 2007
Posts: 500
Location: Cambs


PostPosted: Sat Sep 01, 2018 9:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks for all the suggestions about the oil overfill

It's definitely not overfilled but I did add half a litre of oil whilst the engine was cold. I did this a few days ago and I did wonder if it could have caused the problem but I checked the oil level properly when the engine was warm and the oil level is only up to the top of the mark on the dipstick .

In the past I've never added oil when the engine is cold and always done it when the engine is up to temperature and with the engine running .

the oil I have cleaned off the engine and the heat exchanger looks very clean and new so I guess the engine blew the new oil back up the filler tube and spread it everywhere.

So after a couple of cleanup operations and warming up short runsin the car most of the spilt oil has gone and it's only smoking a little bit now . Hopefully if I keep wiping it down and anything on the exhaust and heat exchanger gets burnt off eventually everything will be back to normal .

A small amount of oil certainly makes a lot of mess and spreads itself around a bit .
 
  
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madalaa
Fuji


Joined: 13 Mar 2008
Posts: 9358
Location: West London

2009 Porsche Boxster 987

PostPosted: Sun Sep 02, 2018 5:23 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

........ it might have pooled in the undertray ....... worth having a looking and cleaning if necessary.
 
  
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ollster
Montreal


Joined: 10 Jun 2009
Posts: 523
Location: Sheffield


PostPosted: Sun Sep 02, 2018 7:39 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

A993LAD wrote:
Thanks for all the suggestions about the oil overfill

It's definitely not overfilled but I did add half a litre of oil whilst the engine was cold. I did this a few days ago and I did wonder if it could have caused the problem but I checked the oil level properly when the engine was warm and the oil level is only up to the top of the mark on the dipstick .

In the past I've never added oil when the engine is cold and always done it when the engine is up to temperature and with the engine running .

the oil I have cleaned off the engine and the heat exchanger looks very clean and new so I guess the engine blew the new oil back up the filler tube and spread it everywhere.

So after a couple of cleanup operations and warming up short runsin the car most of the spilt oil has gone and it's only smoking a little bit now . Hopefully if I keep wiping it down and anything on the exhaust and heat exchanger gets burnt off eventually everything will be back to normal .

A small amount of oil certainly makes a lot of mess and spreads itself around a bit .


How hot was the engine, I never shoot for the top of the dip stick even when stinking hot. If your oil level sensor is relatively accurate I was told it should line up roughly with the oil temp gauge as the engine gets really warm I.e. when temp is at 9 o’clock oil level should be at around 3 o’clock
 
  
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ras62
Montreal


Joined: 20 Jan 2012
Posts: 620
Location: Cheshire


PostPosted: Sun Sep 02, 2018 9:01 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

If your car still has the oil fill extension bellows then I would say it is split and causing the mess when filling.
 
  
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decgraham
Suzuka


Joined: 17 Sep 2008
Posts: 1242
Location: Spain


PostPosted: Sun Sep 02, 2018 10:56 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Or you have a leak Sad lets hope not Thumb but if you want a PDF file, which is too big to load up on here all about leaks I have one. I followed it to deal with a leak on my car. I can send it to you if you PM me with your email address. The write up came off Pelican Parts forum some time ago and it addresses a 964 but our engines are very much the same. Unfortunately its not available any more so can't give you a link.

If you search this forum for oil leaks under my name you'll come up with posts of how I tackled the job. I probably did more than necessary but I pretty much covered all the bases in the end and it was a good way to really get to know the car.

ATB Smile
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A993LAD
Montreal


Joined: 20 Mar 2007
Posts: 500
Location: Cambs


PostPosted: Mon Nov 26, 2018 11:07 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi guys, I have resurrected this thread that I created because the problem has surfaced again so I was hoping to pick the brains of you experts to work out what is happening here.

So to recap:

A couple months ago I added about half a litre of oil to my car but I did it when the car was cold and a few miles down the road there was smoke billowing out of the back of the car. Opening the engine bay revealed a god awful mess of fresh clean oil all over the right-hand side beneath the filler, which was finding its way onto the exhaust and burning very nicely indeed, with not a small amount of smoke finding its way into the cabin.

I had to clean the engine bay about three times because every time I cleaned it more oil (from the original splurge) would come out of different areas to spread itself about nicely every time I drove the car. It's clear that the wind vortex in the engine bay under motion would impress even Mr Dyson.

Having finally got the engine bay clean and burnt off any oil that I didn't manage to find everything was back to normal.

Until Saturday! When I thought I would check and top up the oil up a bit. To be honest, it was pretty much up at the top of the twisty marker on the dipstick, but I like to see it registered on the dashboard gauge too, which seems to measure quite low. Anyway, having added the oil, and this time did it correctly with the engine warm and running,I then put the car away.

The following day I took the car for a quick spin. 2 miles down the road there was suddenly massive clouds of smoke behind me so I pulled over, opened the engine bay, to find fresh oil splurged all over the place again!!

I'm definitely not missing the of the filler tube and pouring it round the edge as I'm using a funnel and it's definitely going down the tube. And I'm also definitely replacing the filler cap which has a rubber seal inside it.

Any ideas on how my car is jettisoning this new oil instead of receiving it in the oil tank will be gratefully received.

I have owned the car for several years and topped up by oil regularly during that time without any problem until the last two top ups.
 
  
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Cameltoe & Heel
Suzuka


Joined: 26 Jan 2009
Posts: 1205
Location: Preston - Lancs


PostPosted: Mon Nov 26, 2018 1:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

hmmm looking at one of your pics it seems to suggest that oil is being pushed back up the filler tube under some pressure. I'm not sure what would cause this, perhaps a surge for whatever reason?, were you giving it some beans?.

How's the seal look on the oil cap?,

Trev
 
  
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Endoman
Suzuka


Joined: 11 Apr 2011
Posts: 1191
Location: Bolton U.K.


PostPosted: Mon Nov 26, 2018 1:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

If the oil level was correct with the dipstick and there was no reading in the cabin then your float is not registering correctly. They are notoriously unreliable.
There is a breather valve at the top of the oil tank if this has failed and oil level is high (overfilled) crankcase pressure will blow it out of the filler tube.
If oil gets in the crankcase/tank breather pipe again though over filling you will get an air lock which will release though the filler as the tank vent can't cope.
I run 1/2 dipsick height and the guage never registers.
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A993LAD
Montreal


Joined: 20 Mar 2007
Posts: 500
Location: Cambs


PostPosted: Mon Nov 26, 2018 4:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Endoman wrote:
If the oil level was correct with the dipstick and there was no reading in the cabin then your float is not registering correctly. They are notoriously unreliable.
There is a breather valve at the top of the oil tank if this has failed and oil level is high (overfilled) crankcase pressure will blow it out of the filler tube.
If oil gets in the crankcase/tank breather pipe again though over filling you will get an air lock which will release though the filler as the tank vent can't cope.
I run 1/2 dipsick height and the guage never registers.


Thanks

I guess it must be this as the dipstick shows full.

When it gets this blowback pressure, where is the oil spraying out from?

The breather pipe or the filler tube? The cap on the filler tube looks pretty well sealed to me and I have no idea where the breather valve is but I guess under the wheel arch where the oil tank is?

Looks like another cleaning job for me and a more diligent regime to making sure there is the right oil level in the car.
 
  
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Endoman
Suzuka


Joined: 11 Apr 2011
Posts: 1191
Location: Bolton U.K.


PostPosted: Mon Nov 26, 2018 7:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The oil tank breather valve is on top of the oil tank, item 6 in the PET.
Usual sign of overfilling is clouds of blue smoke as excess oil get sucked into the inlet manifold. The filler cap is not neccessarily oil tight. The expansion of oil when hot is negligeable the main thing is to ensure the thermostat is fully open when checking the oil level and then wait til the fan comes on. It looks like you are getting a sudden surge of oil into the tank when the stat opens.
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deMort
Zolder


Joined: 21 Mar 2015
Posts: 5563
Location: Brighton


PostPosted: Mon Nov 26, 2018 8:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Agree

From your original pictures then the oil is comeing out of the oil filler cap .. the car was fine i assume before you added oil .

As said .. this float lvl indicator is not brilliant .

To check , the oil must be at operateing temp .. put your hand on the o/s/f wing .. if its hot then the State is open and you can check the lvl.

I always leave the lvl a little low as otherwise when cornering and oil is at temp it can do exactly this .

Best way to drain some of the oil is probably remove the wing oil filter as draining at the sump tends to go wrong !!
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A993LAD
Montreal


Joined: 20 Mar 2007
Posts: 500
Location: Cambs


PostPosted: Tue Nov 27, 2018 9:33 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks for the replies

I will definitely warm the car up and check that the thermostat is opening as you suggest.

When I pour new oil into the filler tube is there anything that controls whether it goes into the oil tank or not?

I'm only asking because the oil that gets belched out is so clean it looks like it is only the new oil I have just poured down the tube. ie it doesn't look like it has ever been round the engine or mixed with the existing oil which has probably done five or 6000 miles and I would expect to be a bit different in appearance to the beautiful nectar coloured new oil.
 
  
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Cameltoe & Heel
Suzuka


Joined: 26 Jan 2009
Posts: 1205
Location: Preston - Lancs


PostPosted: Tue Nov 27, 2018 10:57 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

You seemed to imply that the oil flow down the pipe was ok whilst filling, otherwise I was going to suggest a possible blockage through an obstruction of some sort or maybe a kink in the pipe?

One more thought, do you use the retractable filler neck when topping up?, is yours in good order?, I've heard of these disintegrating and causing ingestion of plastic pieces into the oil tank. could that be blocking or holding fresh oil?

Trev

Last edited by Cameltoe & Heel on Tue Nov 27, 2018 11:20 am; edited 1 time in total
 
  
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