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porsche996aero
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Joined: 09 Feb 2018
Posts: 16



PostPosted: Sat Feb 10, 2018 1:18 pm    Post subject: Friends Green Porsche - Bad Experience now Resolved, but... Reply with quote

Hi guys. Long time lurker here. I wouldn't normally air my dirty laundry in public but I thought I should probably share a pretty unpleasant experience I've had over the last week or so with friends green porsche.

TLDR: seller withholding deposit after I decided not to buy a car with a major engine issue flagged up by my independent inspection!

I'll spare you the majority of the tedious details, but suffice to say I went to see one of the silver 'factory fitted' aerokit 996s (turns out there's no evidence the kit was factory fitted) from him last week and put down a (fully refundable, given any issues found) deposit on it. The PPI that I had carried out by Porsche Inspections then flagged up a serious issue with the engine (camshaft deviation readings way out of spec). We discussed options for his garage carrying out remedial work, after which I decided not to go ahead with the sale - it's quite possible that the engine will need a complete rebuild in the near future, which unsurprisingly wasn't on the cards.

Unfortunately, he's now flatly refusing to refund my £500 deposit in full and I'm going to have to explore other avenues to reclaim it from him. Caveat emptor!

Interested to know if others have had any similar experiences?

Mod info edit "Title Updated to include the words 'now resolved' by the Original Poster"

Last edited by porsche996aero on Fri Feb 16, 2018 3:44 pm; edited 1 time in total
 
  
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FZP
Magny-Cours


Joined: 18 Jan 2015
Posts: 2709
Location: Cheshire


PostPosted: Sat Feb 10, 2018 1:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

In writing I would stipulate as to why you're not going ahead and demand your deposit back. Try and get in writing as to why they're not willing to give your deposit back.
A quick letter from a solicitor after that should sort it out quick smart.
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Fastlane
Spa-Francorchamps


Joined: 05 Mar 2017
Posts: 344
Location: Truro


PostPosted: Sat Feb 10, 2018 2:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sorry to hear about that - seems very odd behaviour from Friends Green. Is it this car:

https://www.friendsgreenporsche.com/product-page/porsche-996-carrera-manual-aero-kit-non-sun-roof-rebuilt-gearbox
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asterix_the_gaul
Suzuka


Joined: 20 Dec 2008
Posts: 1131
Location: Cheshire

1999 Porsche 996 Carrera 2

PostPosted: Sat Feb 10, 2018 2:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Saw that car advertised, thought it would not be around long as seemed a nice spec and good price. Surprised at the reaction of fg, certainly I would spend a couple of quid on a solicitors letter which should get you your money back, shame to be out of pocket but better 65 on a letter and at least get your deposit back.

What solutions or other options were offered? What Was The recommend work required by the inspection report?.
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porsche996aero
Newbie


Joined: 09 Feb 2018
Posts: 16



PostPosted: Sat Feb 10, 2018 3:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

asterix_the_gaul wrote:
Saw that car advertised, thought it would not be around long as seemed a nice spec and good price. Surprised at the reaction of fg, certainly I would spend a couple of quid on a solicitors letter which should get you your money back, shame to be out of pocket but better 65 on a letter and at least get your deposit back.

What solutions or other options were offered? What Was The recommend work required by the inspection report?.


Thanks for the replies guys.

Actually it's the other one (listed somewhat ironically as 'deposit taken'):

https://www.friendsgreenporsche.com/product-page/porsche-996-carrera-manual-deposit-taken

The inspection concluded that "it is a matter of time until the engine requires potentially expensive work", and I was given advice that this could include a full engine rebuild.

I did discuss options with his mechanic for identifying/addressing the issue, which included a range of actions from cutting open the oil filter, examining the IMS bearing, pulling the chain tensioners, checking the cam timing, and examining the variocam wear pads (kudos to his mechanic for being extremely helpful). The seller did offer to go ahead with these as part of remedial work on the condition that I paid half. Whilst initially thinking this could be a good idea, on further research, and having talked to another Porsche engine specialist, I decided the risk wasn't worth it (especially as the seller required me to go through with the purchase and collection of the car before the remedial work).

For clarity, the seller did offer a partial refund of the deposit, which I refused.
 
  
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Robertb
Long Beach


Joined: 01 Sep 2003
Posts: 6723
Location: South Oxfordshire

2002 Porsche 996 Carrera 4S

PostPosted: Sat Feb 10, 2018 3:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Seems to me that under Consumer Rights Act the car is not fit for purpose.

I would imagine Trading Standards could get involved if they won't refund your deposit in full.
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HSC911
Zolder


Joined: 23 Jul 2014
Posts: 5725
Location: Bedford


PostPosted: Sat Feb 10, 2018 3:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

porsche996aero wrote:
listed somewhat ironically as 'deposit taken


Well at least he was honest about one thing Grin Bandit

nooo
 
  
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Fast Bug
Monza


Joined: 01 Nov 2017
Posts: 217



PostPosted: Sat Feb 10, 2018 5:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

What does your order form state about returning of deposits? It's very rare for a dealership to keep any deposit unless it's a factory order in an oddball colour/spec or money has been spent on a used car at the customers request.

Mke sure you put the request in writing as to why you're cancelling, state a reasonable deadline for the deposit to be returned and be prepared to escalate it. Unless you paid on a credit card, in which case just call them and get them to recover it
 
  
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Phil 997
Brands Hatch
Brands Hatch


Joined: 05 Dec 2015
Posts: 14561
Location: Bournemouth,Dorset

2009 Porsche 997 Carrera 4S

PostPosted: Sat Feb 10, 2018 5:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

all great advise , just for ref if it was a factory aero as stated would it not be listed on the door plate under the code for aerokit, having said that I do remember reading that along with the factory aero there was also the dealer aero and this wasnt listed on the door plate but the info should be available in the dealer network.
only mentioned for future ref for you or to use as ammo if needed re the description of the car for sale Thumb
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Phil 997
Brands Hatch
Brands Hatch


Joined: 05 Dec 2015
Posts: 14561
Location: Bournemouth,Dorset

2009 Porsche 997 Carrera 4S

PostPosted: Sat Feb 10, 2018 5:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I was just wondering if the dealer has been good up to now and only the deposit is an issue why have you not considered the other silver aerokitted car
I know its the other style of aero kit from the 996 on that one but it looks a nice car Grin
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porsche996aero
Newbie


Joined: 09 Feb 2018
Posts: 16



PostPosted: Sat Feb 10, 2018 6:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Phil 997 wrote:
all great advise , just for ref if it was a factory aero as stated would it not be listed on the door plate under the code for aerokit, having said that I do remember reading that along with the factory aero there was also the dealer aero and this wasnt listed on the door plate but the info should be available in the dealer network.
only mentioned for future ref for you or to use as ammo if needed re the description of the car for sale Thumb


thumbsup

Thanks all for the excellent advice.

Aero kit wasn't listed on the extras list under bonnet or in the service book but I guess there's a *chance* it could have been dealer fitted.

I really love the curves on the aerokit cup spoiler so the other one (disregarding my experience with the seller) doesn't do it for me in quite the same way...
 
  
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Phil 997
Brands Hatch
Brands Hatch


Joined: 05 Dec 2015
Posts: 14561
Location: Bournemouth,Dorset

2009 Porsche 997 Carrera 4S

PostPosted: Sat Feb 10, 2018 6:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

porsche996aero wrote:
Phil 997 wrote:
all great advise , just for ref if it was a factory aero as stated would it not be listed on the door plate under the code for aerokit, having said that I do remember reading that along with the factory aero there was also the dealer aero and this wasnt listed on the door plate but the info should be available in the dealer network.
only mentioned for future ref for you or to use as ammo if needed re the description of the car for sale Thumb


thumbsup

Thanks all for the excellent advice.

Aero kit wasn't listed on the extras list under bonnet or in the service book but I guess there's a *chance* it could have been dealer fitted.

really love the curves on the aerokit cup spoiler so the other one (disregarding my experience with the seller) doesn't do it for me in quite the same way...


Well I think purely on the fact that it says factory fitted in the ad and its not on the spec of the car thats enough info on its own to get a full refund. without anything else .
Yes I understand if you particularly like that style of Aero kit, we only got one option on the 997 Grin

Keep us posted on the outcome of this and your continued search Thumb
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Palladium
Indianapolis


Joined: 01 Nov 2015
Posts: 2496



PostPosted: Sat Feb 10, 2018 6:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

they are probably reading this and your deposit will be back by Friday


as an aside, i just don't understand why anybody would want an aerokit, factory or not nooo

each to their own
 
  
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IanG1
Trainee


Joined: 08 Jan 2016
Posts: 98



PostPosted: Sat Feb 10, 2018 6:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Interesting thread, offered them 17.5k for the yellow car and was politely refused, I would have been worried now if he had accepted?
 
  
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squelch
Nürburgring


Joined: 05 Jun 2016
Posts: 375
Location: Bucks


PostPosted: Sat Feb 10, 2018 8:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

You need to save and print the whole advert and write to them highlighting that the product they're selling does not match its description. The salient wording being:

"Mechanics. The Porsche has been cared for meticulously throughout it's life and as a result the mechanics can not be faulted."

A PPI has proven that the mechanics clearly can be (and are) faulted, so this is a false declaration under the Trade Description Act and thus false advertising.

I would start with an appropriately firmly worded letter from yourself (no point in lining the pockets of bottom-feeding ambulance chasers until it's absolutely necessary), outlining their failing to meet their obligations to you as a consumer and clearly giving them seven days to refund your deposit. You could also state for good measure that you are taking legal advice as to whether you are in a position to claim against them for the cost of the PPI as the vehicle was clearly advertised stating that "the mechanics can not be faulted". I would state that the purpose of the PPI was to identify any acceptable remedial work which may be required, hence your desire to obtain one, but the major concerns raised are far more than acceptable and again in direct contradiction to what was advertised. (The balance of power is such that the consumer is at a disadvantage to a professional seller, and as such Trading Standards will take a dim view of a Porsche Specialist selling a car which they would reasonably be expected to know has existing issues.)

The power of social media and online reviews shouldn't be underestimated, so it's also worth including in the letter that you are a member of many Facebook groups and online fora (both Porsche and general petrolhead types) and you will ensure that as many people as possible hear about your terrible experience with them and their sharp practices and the dubious quality of the car you had inspected (you can only slate this one car as it's the only one you had inspected remember and keeping it specific will avoid any libel litigation on their part). None of this is a threat or any kind of blackmail, it is simply you succinctly and directly informing them of how you will proceed if a satisfactory outcome is not attained within the next week.

Hope this helps!
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HSC911
Zolder


Joined: 23 Jul 2014
Posts: 5725
Location: Bedford


PostPosted: Sat Feb 10, 2018 10:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'd send the chap a link to this thread nooo

Happy to do so on your behalf if you want Dont know

Thumb
 
  
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kurlykris
Watkins Glen


Joined: 30 Jun 2014
Posts: 2213
Location: Warwickshire


PostPosted: Sat Feb 10, 2018 10:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

HSC911 wrote:
I'd send the chap a link to this thread nooo

Happy to do so on your behalf if you want Dont know

Thumb


Yeah

I can`t quite believe that a Porsche Trader with any decent reputation would risk that for a paltry £500 nooo
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crash7
Montreal


Joined: 28 May 2011
Posts: 521



PostPosted: Sat Feb 10, 2018 10:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

There was chat on another thread about them providing poor customer service and that they were best avoided.
 
  
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HSC911
Zolder


Joined: 23 Jul 2014
Posts: 5725
Location: Bedford


PostPosted: Sat Feb 10, 2018 11:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

crash7 wrote:
There was chat on another thread about them providing poor customer service and that they were best avoided.


Yep Bandit

http://911uk.com/viewtopic.php?t=123637
 
  
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Porsche News
Motoring Editor
Motoring Editor


Joined: 08 Feb 2008
Posts: 7023



PostPosted: Sun Feb 11, 2018 10:52 am    Post subject: Re: Friends Green Porsche - Bad Experience Reply with quote

porsche996aero wrote:
Hi guys. Long time lurker here. I wouldn't normally air my dirty laundry in public but I thought I should probably share a pretty unpleasant experience I've had over the last week or so with friends green porsche.

TLDR: seller withholding deposit after I decided not to buy a car with a major engine issue flagged up by my independent inspection!

I'll spare you the majority of the tedious details, but suffice to say I went to see one of the silver 'factory fitted' aerokit 996s (turns out there's no evidence the kit was factory fitted) from him last week and put down a (fully refundable, given any issues found) deposit on it. The PPI that I had carried out by Porsche Inspections then flagged up a serious issue with the engine (camshaft deviation readings way out of spec). We discussed options for his garage carrying out remedial work, after which I decided not to go ahead with the sale - it's quite possible that the engine will need a complete rebuild in the near future, which unsurprisingly wasn't on the cards.

Unfortunately, he's now flatly refusing to refund my £500 deposit in full and I'm going to have to explore other avenues to reclaim it from him. Caveat emptor!

Interested to know if others have had any similar experiences?


https://www.friendsgreenporsche.com/product-page/porsche-996-carrera-manual-deposit-taken

that is a shocking situation
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