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Jamesx19
Monza


Joined: 10 Jul 2015
Posts: 195
Location: Brighton


PostPosted: Sat Aug 12, 2017 3:54 pm    Post subject: Oil level appears to increase - injectors? Reply with quote

Hi,

Noticed the oil level recently increase! No reduction in coolant level, no smoking, no fuel smell from oil filler.

I'm thinking a leaking injector. Any other thoughts?

Regards James
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Demort
Paul Ricard


Joined: 21 Mar 2015
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Location: Sussex


PostPosted: Sat Aug 12, 2017 4:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

A leaking injector would cause rough running and sometimes smoke from the exhaust after the car has been turned off .. misfire type of syptoms so does the car run rough ?

How much has the gauge increased by ?

Coolant is what i would expect so has your car got a dipstick you could look at ?

If none of the above then perhaps the lvl sender is faulty .

Edit to say your car should have a dipstick so look at the colour of the oil on it .
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Jamesx19
Monza


Joined: 10 Jul 2015
Posts: 195
Location: Brighton


PostPosted: Sat Aug 12, 2017 4:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Cheers for swift reply Demort.

No rough running except once or twice very briefly on start up, but not for a couple of weeks.

I first noticed the level had increased slightly after it had come back from new clutch. As the tensioners had been slackened off and new washers replaced at the same time as the IMS bearing seal plate, I thought oil would have drained out and the garage had just refilled a little high. (As checked on the dip stick) being a perfectionist/ obsessive I drained about 250 ml out again. I've now noticed this has gone back up. Again measured via dipstick.

Would a leaking injector produce an error in an OBD2 reader? I have one, but not checked yet.

Edit to say, no emulsion. Oil colour appears the same as before
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thecarfixer
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Joined: 03 Nov 2016
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PostPosted: Sat Aug 12, 2017 4:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Oil analysis.

Otherwise it's conjecture.
 
  
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Demort
Paul Ricard


Joined: 21 Mar 2015
Posts: 3446
Location: Sussex


PostPosted: Sat Aug 12, 2017 5:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The oil would have been drained for the tensioner seal so thats going to be the lvl fault at that time .

Personnelly i prefer the gauge so check it there and see if its correct.

The fault code system is not brilliant on early cars .. its looking for open/short circuit to flag a code which this isnt ...

if it was leaking then you would have exccessive fuel in the cylinder which would cause plug fouling , rough running and the car will flag a code for misfire .

In mild cases you would only see a rough running on actual values but that is not an option to look at on your car im afraid .

No Emulsion is the main thing as thats the biggest concern .. if it is fuel then your fuel consumption will raise as you have to think how much fuel would have to go into the oil to raise the lvl .

It may well be nothing so i would advise " customer to monitor " for now Smile
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Jamesx19
Monza


Joined: 10 Jul 2015
Posts: 195
Location: Brighton


PostPosted: Sat Aug 12, 2017 5:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ok cheers Demort. I have a cheap OBD2 I will check anyway.

Also, will pull the plugs and have a look in case. If one of them looks sooty, I'll assume injector is at fault, otherwise reassured for now.

Carfixer, you are right, though it's not water so must be fuel, an oil exam will tell me how bad the oil degradation might be.

Probably time to pull the injector rails and get the injectors cleaned and seals re done anyway, as per Cobras recent posts....
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thecarfixer
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PostPosted: Sat Aug 12, 2017 6:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jamesx19 wrote:

Probably time to pull the injector rails and get the injectors cleaned and seals re done anyway, as per Cobras recent posts....


If the AOS is of questionable length of service, do it at the same time as this.
 
  
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Jamesx19
Monza


Joined: 10 Jul 2015
Posts: 195
Location: Brighton


PostPosted: Sun Aug 13, 2017 8:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Roger that Carfixer. Had to replace the rubber bellow late last year due to a split. No issue since.

OBD2 no codes, I/M emissions shows no issues either.

Now that I think, I noticed the hot idle oil pressure was a bit down recently too.

Don't think I'm going to drive it till I pull the injectors and have them tested. Won't hurt to have them cleaned and rubber seals replaced anyway.
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Jamesx19
Monza


Joined: 10 Jul 2015
Posts: 195
Location: Brighton


PostPosted: Thu Aug 17, 2017 3:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Pulled the spark plugs - No sooty deposits, all clean and in good nick, no smell of fuel.

Southern carbs have tested the injectors - None leaking, tested at much lower and higher pressure than fuel pump would produce with no ill effect. Spray pattern OK, all within tolerance.

I'm Stumped!

Its not like the level is variable. Its definitely increased 200-300ml. Coolant level is bang on with no variation at all, and no condensation or emulsion in the filler cap.

Does the AOS cause a depression in the sump that may allow the level to rise slightly?

Next step is oil for analysis as per Carfixers advice. Can't think of anything else!!!

Dont know
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Demort
Paul Ricard


Joined: 21 Mar 2015
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Location: Sussex


PostPosted: Thu Aug 17, 2017 6:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The AOS just seperates the oil from the good burnable gasses in the crank case .. its a filter basically and for an AOS failure then you dont have the usual symptoms .. increased oil lvl is at least not one ive ever seen from an AOS .


You only have coolant or fuel that could increase the lvl and both seem to be ok .

Carbon canister side goes into the intake so i cant see a fault there .

All ive got and its not much is different oil temperatures when you have checked it as the oil will expand as it gets hot .. basically Dont know
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Jamesx19
Monza


Joined: 10 Jul 2015
Posts: 195
Location: Brighton


PostPosted: Thu Aug 17, 2017 6:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yep weird.......

Will the oil tested and see what next. Cheers for your thoughts Demort, helps to have an experienced professional to bounce ideas off. Keeps me sane!
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Demort
Paul Ricard


Joined: 21 Mar 2015
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Location: Sussex


PostPosted: Thu Aug 17, 2017 6:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

James .. you know im not far from you so i can always come have a look one weekend if you want .. just not this weekend as i have to work Very Happy

BUT .. i do call a spade a spade Razz
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Jamesx19
Monza


Joined: 10 Jul 2015
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Location: Brighton


PostPosted: Thu Aug 17, 2017 7:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Brilliant, thanks Demort. I'm off to France this weekend anyway!

Will be about Saturday and Sunday 9th and 10th if not fixed by then. Though you might be off to the Revival that weekend .....

I'm going on the Friday this year.

Thanks again, I'll let you know what happens.
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ragpicker
Paul Ricard


Joined: 14 Apr 2013
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Location: North East England


PostPosted: Thu Aug 17, 2017 7:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I thought it would be the oil level different due to the temperature of it being different each time it was measured.... That was my thoughts when I first read the post.

I'm struggling to link the injectors/fuel rail and raising oil levels though, I reckon the OP just fancies removing the rails and injectors and is looking for an excuse for his better half.... 'just nipping into the garage for a few days love, the injectors need removing... the lads on the forum told me so

Grin
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s70rjw
Monza


Joined: 26 Nov 2014
Posts: 201
Location: York


PostPosted: Fri Aug 18, 2017 2:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Have you been doing a lot of short journeys recently? I'm thinking maybe condensation.
 
  
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Jamesx19
Monza


Joined: 10 Jul 2015
Posts: 195
Location: Brighton


PostPosted: Fri Aug 18, 2017 3:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ragpicker - Any excuse!!!!!

s70rjw - Yes I have, and that may possibly be the issue? Fuel and water will be burnt off on longer journeys.

Oil sent to Millers for a check.

Otherwise, will bolt it back together and find another excuse to rebuild something else soon!
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skinny_monkey
Spa-Francorchamps


Joined: 16 Sep 2014
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PostPosted: Fri Aug 18, 2017 7:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The preconditioning ahead of the oil reading will have a significant impact on the level. Its not a normal engine where all the oil in the head drains down - the M96 is will known for oil hang up around corners as it gets stuck in the flat heads. So unless you drive the same route and conditions before you check your oil level then it can be different. The Aston V8 we have can see a difference of up to 6 litres hang up in extreme (1.5g) cornering on slicks.

Inclination and oil temp will also cause different level readings
 
  
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Jamesx19
Monza


Joined: 10 Jul 2015
Posts: 195
Location: Brighton


PostPosted: Fri Aug 18, 2017 7:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

That is a good point skinny-monkey.

I remember seeing a post that said you need to get the oil hot ( 30 min drive) switch off, then ignition on - don't start obviously.... And see what gauge says.

I tend to measure oil always cold, and using the dip stick. Maybe, as you say it's just oil draining completely down as opposed to getting hung up in the heads......
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Demort
Paul Ricard


Joined: 21 Mar 2015
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PostPosted: Fri Aug 18, 2017 7:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Have you checked it hot and on the gauge ?

I think you should and then do the same for a day or 2 Smile
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Jamesx19
Monza


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Location: Brighton


PostPosted: Fri Aug 18, 2017 7:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ok wiill do. France tomorrow morning, will report back in a couple of weeks.
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