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New diesel and petrol cars face 2040 ban

Ptabi

Well-known member
Joined
12 Nov 2016
Messages
82
Morning fellow Porsche lovers,

Was just wondering what we all felt about this subject.

I adore my car and even though 2040 is a long way ahead the thought fills me with dread.

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997 Turbo S 2012
BMW 320 Touring
 
The way that car design is going the cars are all becoming hybrid, everything on them is becoming more contrived and artificial (exhaust noises through the stereo, over engineered gear shifts), it is probably the natural way things will go anyway. Power delivery is becoming much more linear and dull, you don't have to drive a car in the way you used to. Some people don't even like a manual gearbox any more.
So long as the plans for power generation and energy storage are done alongside it then it should be OK from a transport point of view. Given how battery power is moving forwards now there will always be the potential to make the cars faster / different in the same way that there is now, although how much will actually be achievable due to the different technologies involved is anybody's guess.
It will be interesting to see what the last of the petrol engine cars will be like, will the companies want to go out on one last great triumph or will the legislation on everything have been tightened up so that they just can't make anything that isn't a turbocharged petrol electric hybrid by then anyway?
I do feel very privileged that I have lived and owned cars in what seems to me at least to be a fantastic time for car design and performance. I have witnessed the ongoing development of the petrol engine to what almost became an art form before it got gradually corrupted by the tree huggers and bean counters.
The sale of new petrol cars is being banned, but I assume it will be another 20-30 years before they are mainly gone from the roads. Given then I will be just about to turn 70 by the time the ban is introduced, the ban in itself doesn't concern me greatly and to be honest I can see that all of the car manufacturers have already started on the slippery slop to get there anyway.

MC
 
it's certainly a political idea but not the solution

considering there are 26m cars on the road in the UK and by 2040 that figure would probably be closer to 40m

New cars would be by then the tip of the iceberg
 
Agree with mistercorn above. However, the emissions zones will have an impact sooner. It will start with diesels and then rapidly move on to petrol. Imagine living in towns or cities and owning anything with large n/a capacity or v8 or v12 in 10 years assuming they phase this in? ..combined with the charging infrastructure Rollout, that will likely concentrate on towns first, it will mean townies will sit in quiet electric traffic jams and the country folk can trade tractors in for cheap 997 4.0's for while hopefully :)

It will be interesting to see the impact on true collectors cars as not many of those are driven anyway.

At least we know it's coming and have plenty of time to enjoy the pinnacle of the internal combustion engined cars...hopefully some of the mad values can take a hit. We can then buy them and drive them without the speculators :?:
 
Last figures I could find were that in the UK we use around 45 billion litres of road fuel per year, at an energy rate of about 10kWh/l this means that we would need around 450 billion kWh or 450 terrawatt hours (TWh) to replace all of the fuel that we use with electricity.
In 2014 the total electricity demand in the UK was 301.7TWh according to Wikipedia.
The figures above won't be quite right due to different efficiencies in the electric cars, but you get the idea. If we didn't use petrol or diesel we would need to basically double of electricity production. I don't see any plans for this right now.

MC
 
http://www.autoexpress.co.uk/car-news/96327/could-whisky-be-the-car-fuel-of-the-future

.....hiccup

One thing is for sure, with today's announcement and the one from France the creative juices will be flowing to find a new fuel system(other than electric)

I think something will be found along the hydrogen/seawater route.

Can you imagine the load placed on our infrastructures to charge batteries on cars.....Electric is more cleaner but does it harm the environment at the back-end?

"But those smokestacks, many attached to coal-fired power plants, are the single-largest source of greenhouse gas pollution in the U.S., at two billion metric tons of CO2 per year. That source would grow as electric cars demand more and more electricity, unless tighter pollution controls are placed on power plants or electric utilities shift to less polluting sources such as solar. As it stands, a conventional Toyota Prius hybrid vehicle, which burns gasoline when its batteries are not engaged, and the all-electric Nissan Leaf produce roughly the same amount of greenhouse gas pollution: 200 grams per mile"
 
I love these announcements as we drive around the Basra oilfields with oilfires burning all over the shop, and a massive industry dependant entirely on the black stuff. I hope the rest of the undeveloped world knows about this :?:

Oil- there's an awful l lot more left than was previously anticipated, would be a shame not to use it :thumbs:
 
spongebob squarepants said:
I love these announcements as we drive around the Basra oilfields with oilfires burning all over the shop, and a massive industry dependant entirely on the black stuff. I hope the rest of the undeveloped world knows about this :?:

Oil- there's an awful l lot more left than was previously anticipated, would be a shame not to use it :thumbs:

It still will have its uses, like aviation fuel and plastics. I can't see big ships running on batteries any time soon.
It won't end when we run out of oil. Pretty sure that the stone age didn't end because they ran out of stone, technology just moved on.

MC
 
Would the electrification of cars ring the death knell for cars like the Porsche? at the present moment in time a Porsche sells as a performance car because of the extent of its power plant etc but stick an electric motor in it and it just becomes an electric powered car just like any other electric car with a weighty lump installed somewhere which will do wonders for weight distribution etc

If you are into tuning your cars how will that work bigger motors with bigger/more batteries etc.

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Del.
 
As i understand it, the ban is on selling new cars, its not about banning us from driving what we have today



Osh
 
wizard993 said:
http://www.autoexpress.co.uk/car-news/96327/could-whisky-be-the-car-fuel-of-the-future

.....hiccup

One thing is for sure, with today's announcement and the one from France the creative juices will be flowing to find a new fuel system(other than electric)

I think something will be found along the hydrogen/seawater route.

Can you imagine the load placed on our infrastructures to charge batteries on cars.....Electric is more cleaner but does it harm the environment at the back-end?

"But those smokestacks, many attached to coal-fired power plants, are the single-largest source of greenhouse gas pollution in the U.S., at two billion metric tons of CO2 per year. That source would grow as electric cars demand more and more electricity, unless tighter pollution controls are placed on power plants or electric utilities shift to less polluting sources such as solar. As it stands, a conventional Toyota Prius hybrid vehicle, which burns gasoline when its batteries are not engaged, and the all-electric Nissan Leaf produce roughly the same amount of greenhouse gas pollution: 200 grams per mile"

It's now just fuels that are going to be the issue, rather the whole infrastructure supplying power to the National Grid, as even hydrogen has a significant requirement to separate off for use in fuel cells.

As quoted the main issue is that electric cars will simply displace any environmental issue from the point of use to point of supply, and I very much doubt the supply will be 100% clean. Unless the storage of power is improved (one for Elon Musk?), then alternative power may not be enough - expect an outcry from treehuggers if another nuclear plant is announced, although with the time to commission, design and build that doesn't happen overnight.

Still, on a lighter note, the irony of the French being the first to announce this did not escape me, given the historic reputation of reliability of electrical systems in French cars.. French
 
Osh said:
As i understand it, the ban is on selling new cars, its not about banning us from driving what we have today



Osh

But when petrol/Diesel production ends will the Government use the opportunity to tax existing users off the road - I think we all know the answer to that one.

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Del.
 
Osh said:
As i understand it, the ban is on selling new cars, its not about banning us from driving what we have today



Osh

+1
 
MisterCorn said:
spongebob squarepants said:
I love these announcements as we drive around the Basra oilfields with oilfires burning all over the shop, and a massive industry dependant entirely on the black stuff. I hope the rest of the undeveloped world knows about this :?:

Oil- there's an awful l lot more left than was previously anticipated, would be a shame not to use it :thumbs:

It still will have its uses, like aviation fuel and plastics. I can't see big ships running on batteries any time soon.
It won't end when we run out of oil. Pretty sure that the stone age didn't end because they ran out of stone, technology just moved on.

MC

lol 2040 is wildely optimistic. And for the rest of the developing world-nah it isn't going to happen any time soon.
 
Its the oil Sheiks I feel sorry for - even now I bet they are quivering in their sandals worrying if they should cancel the order for the latest fleet of Veyrons! :damn:

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Del.
 

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