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Rob325114
Spa-Francorchamps


Joined: 12 Dec 2015
Posts: 278



PostPosted: Mon Jul 24, 2017 1:47 pm    Post subject: Moving from 997.1 to 991.1 Reply with quote

I'm looking to move from my current 997.1 Cab C2S to a 991.1 Coupe C2S over the coming months. I'm happy to be patient and wait for the right vehicle spec/colour to come along, and given my experiences with the 997.1 (5 figure Hartech rebuild) I am only considering vehicles that have Porsche warranty - preferably purchased directly from the Porsche used approved portfolio.

I have a few questions I thought people on this forum might be able to help with. Admittedly some of these are probably basic; but I have only ever purchased privately, or from indy garages, and never at this value.

1. If I am buying directly from Porsche, do I still need to get an independent inspection? Is there anything I need to be looking out closely for on the 991.1 - particularly things that won't be covered under warranty? I haven’t heard of any catastrophic issues on the 991, like the ones I experienced on the 997 (bore scoring).

2. How much wiggle room do you have on a transaction with OPC. i.e.
- Will they entertain negotiation on the price of the 991.1?
- Will they entertain negotiation on the px value of my 997.1?
- Will they entertain adding bundles to "sweeten" the deal? I'm thinking extended warranty, service packs, roof rack... anything?!

3. The headline OPC finance rate looks to be 9.9%, which is much higher than something you can arrange separately through a broker. Is there any hidden benefit to the OPC finance that I am overlooking?

Thanks in advance, this should help me be better armed when I enter into conversations.
_________________
Current: Agate Grey 991.1 C2S Coupe, PDK
Ex: Black 997.1 Hartech'd C2S Cab, manual
Ex: Silver Citroen C2 GT, manual
Ex: Blue Ford Fiesta Zetec S 1.6, manual
 
  
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spongebob squarepants
Sepang


Joined: 20 Dec 2009
Posts: 2900
Location: Manchester and Iraq


PostPosted: Mon Jul 24, 2017 4:13 pm    Post subject: Re: Moving from 997.1 to 991.1 Reply with quote

Rob325114 wrote:
I'm looking to move from my current 997.1 Cab C2S to a 991.1 Coupe C2S over the coming months. I'm happy to be patient and wait for the right vehicle spec/colour to come along, and given my experiences with the 997.1 (5 figure Hartech rebuild) I am only considering vehicles that have Porsche warranty - preferably purchased directly from the Porsche used approved portfolio.

I have a few questions I thought people on this forum might be able to help with. Admittedly some of these are probably basic; but I have only ever purchased privately, or from indy garages, and never at this value.

1. If I am buying directly from Porsche, do I still need to get an independent inspection? Is there anything I need to be looking out closely for on the 991.1 - particularly things that won't be covered under warranty? I haven’t heard of any catastrophic issues on the 991, like the ones I experienced on the 997 (bore scoring).

2. How much wiggle room do you have on a transaction with OPC. i.e.
- Will they entertain negotiation on the price of the 991.1?
- Will they entertain negotiation on the px value of my 997.1?
- Will they entertain adding bundles to "sweeten" the deal? I'm thinking extended warranty, service packs, roof rack... anything?!

3. The headline OPC finance rate looks to be 9.9%, which is much higher than something you can arrange separately through a broker. Is there any hidden benefit to the OPC finance that I am overlooking?

Thanks in advance, this should help me be better armed when I enter into conversations.


Rob just from personal experience, to question 1 don't see any need for a PPI especially on a 991, all my experiences with OPC (Wilmslow and Belfast) have been if anything goes wrong or is found to be wrong it gets sorted without quibble. The only thing I'd do is a detailed check myself bodywork, alloys, brake callipers, interior etc to make sure it's as new condition wise or get put back to new before purchase. For OPC prices has to be A1+ thumbsup

Re 2 you don't get unless you ask, I certainly got 2000 off a 46 grand car, and if you choose wisely sometimes the warranty can be 3 years anyway, any remaining from the last owner is added to the 2 years, so the average OPC maintained car is likely to have more than 2 years.

Re yours I wouldn't entertain a trade in, with the Hartech it's an easy sale to an enthusiast, and as you say the % rate for loan with OPC is a rip off, go elsewhere. Good luck happy hunting...
_________________
997.2 Carrera 4S PDK (Herman white)
EX 997.2 Carrera S PDK
EX 993 C2 manual in guards red
EX 997 C2 gen 2 PDK
EX 993 Targa
EX 993 Carrera 4 manual
EX 996 3.4 Cabriolet
 
  
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Zingari
Donnington
Donnington


Joined: 25 Oct 2009
Posts: 11788
Location: Cheshire

1993 Porsche 964 Anniversary

PostPosted: Mon Jul 24, 2017 4:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

As Sponge says.

Your car would be punted through the trade and my experience of part ex values from OPC (even on cars they will retail approved used) are shoite what

Plus the mark up on a sale you can negotiate some discount wit no PX
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Phil 997
Fuji


Joined: 05 Dec 2015
Posts: 9827
Location: Bournemouth,Dorset

2009 Porsche 997 Carrera 4S

PostPosted: Mon Jul 24, 2017 4:26 pm    Post subject: Re: Moving from 997.1 to 991.1 Reply with quote

spongebob squarepants wrote:
Rob325114 wrote:
I'm looking to move from my current 997.1 Cab C2S to a 991.1 Coupe C2S over the coming months. I'm happy to be patient and wait for the right vehicle spec/colour to come along, and given my experiences with the 997.1 (5 figure Hartech rebuild) I am only considering vehicles that have Porsche warranty - preferably purchased directly from the Porsche used approved portfolio.

I have a few questions I thought people on this forum might be able to help with. Admittedly some of these are probably basic; but I have only ever purchased privately, or from indy garages, and never at this value.

1. If I am buying directly from Porsche, do I still need to get an independent inspection? Is there anything I need to be looking out closely for on the 991.1 - particularly things that won't be covered under warranty? I haven’t heard of any catastrophic issues on the 991, like the ones I experienced on the 997 (bore scoring).

2. How much wiggle room do you have on a transaction with OPC. i.e.
- Will they entertain negotiation on the price of the 991.1?
- Will they entertain negotiation on the px value of my 997.1?
- Will they entertain adding bundles to "sweeten" the deal? I'm thinking extended warranty, service packs, roof rack... anything?!

3. The headline OPC finance rate looks to be 9.9%, which is much higher than something you can arrange separately through a broker. Is there any hidden benefit to the OPC finance that I am overlooking?

Thanks in advance, this should help me be better armed when I enter into conversations.


Rob just from personal experience, to question 1 don't see any need for a PPI especially on a 991, all my experiences with OPC (Wilmslow and Belfast) have been if anything goes wrong or is found to be wrong it gets sorted without quibble. The only thing I'd do is a detailed check myself bodywork, alloys, brake callipers, interior etc to make sure it's as new condition wise or get put back to new before purchase. For OPC prices has to be A1+ thumbsup

Re 2 you don't get unless you ask, I certainly got 2000 off a 46 grand car, and if you choose wisely sometimes the warranty can be 3 years anyway, any remaining from the last owner is added to the 2 years, so the average OPC maintained car is likely to have more than 2 years.

Re yours I wouldn't entertain a trade in, with the Hartech it's an easy sale to an enthusiast, and as you say the % rate for loan with OPC is a rip off, go elsewhere. Good luck happy hunting...




Great advise Agree and I think that 5% would be the max you would get knocked off and you would have to negotiate hard for that and SBSP's 2k off 46k spend is right on the money there. No benefit in paying the OPC % on finance better to look else where. Thumb
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Rob325114
Spa-Francorchamps


Joined: 12 Dec 2015
Posts: 278



PostPosted: Mon Jul 24, 2017 4:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks for your thoughts Spongebob & Zingari. My budget puts me in an early 991 - probably a 2012 model. Should I assume the car should be nearly perfect at this age? I've always purchased older models, so expected a bit of wear - but want to make sure I am getting the best from the OPC.

I'm pleased to hear there's possible wiggle room on OPC prices.

I asked an OPC informally about my car previously, and they confirmed with a non-OPC rebuild they wouldn't be allowed to re-sell it, even if it was otherwise spanking condition with low miles. Hence they would offer me a fairly poor px value. I'll get it up for sale privately whilst I wait for the right 991 to come along - I best get a move on, given it's a cab!
_________________
Current: Agate Grey 991.1 C2S Coupe, PDK
Ex: Black 997.1 Hartech'd C2S Cab, manual
Ex: Silver Citroen C2 GT, manual
Ex: Blue Ford Fiesta Zetec S 1.6, manual
 
  
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Phil 997
Fuji


Joined: 05 Dec 2015
Posts: 9827
Location: Bournemouth,Dorset

2009 Porsche 997 Carrera 4S

PostPosted: Mon Jul 24, 2017 4:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rob325114 wrote:
Thanks for your thoughts Spongebob & Zingari. My budget puts me in an early 991 - probably a 2012 model. Should I assume the car should be nearly perfect at this age? I've always purchased older models, so expected a bit of wear - but want to make sure I am getting the best from the OPC.

I'm pleased to hear there's possible wiggle room on OPC prices.

I asked an OPC informally about my car previously, and they confirmed with a non-OPC rebuild they wouldn't be allowed to re-sell it, even if it was otherwise spanking condition with low miles. Hence they would offer me a fairly poor px value. I'll get it up for sale privately whilst I wait for the right 991 to come along - I best get a move on, given it's a cab!


Rob I would get an ad on here and start a thread about selling it as there are always guys on here looking for hartech rebuilt 997.1s and there seems to be a thread almost every week about someone or another on the hunt for one.
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Others Enjoy The Moment Today.
 
  
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Rob325114
Spa-Francorchamps


Joined: 12 Dec 2015
Posts: 278



PostPosted: Mon Jul 24, 2017 4:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Phil 997 wrote:
Rob325114 wrote:
Thanks for your thoughts Spongebob & Zingari. My budget puts me in an early 991 - probably a 2012 model. Should I assume the car should be nearly perfect at this age? I've always purchased older models, so expected a bit of wear - but want to make sure I am getting the best from the OPC.

I'm pleased to hear there's possible wiggle room on OPC prices.

I asked an OPC informally about my car previously, and they confirmed with a non-OPC rebuild they wouldn't be allowed to re-sell it, even if it was otherwise spanking condition with low miles. Hence they would offer me a fairly poor px value. I'll get it up for sale privately whilst I wait for the right 991 to come along - I best get a move on, given it's a cab!


Rob I would get an ad on here and start a thread about selling it as there are always guys on here looking for hartech rebuilt 997.1s and there seems to be a thread almost every week about someone or another on the hunt for one.


Thanks Phil - I will do just that. If you see anyone after a 997.1 manual C2S cab, send them my way Smile
_________________
Current: Agate Grey 991.1 C2S Coupe, PDK
Ex: Black 997.1 Hartech'd C2S Cab, manual
Ex: Silver Citroen C2 GT, manual
Ex: Blue Ford Fiesta Zetec S 1.6, manual
 
  
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Phil 997
Fuji


Joined: 05 Dec 2015
Posts: 9827
Location: Bournemouth,Dorset

2009 Porsche 997 Carrera 4S

PostPosted: Mon Jul 24, 2017 4:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rob325114 wrote:
Phil 997 wrote:
Rob325114 wrote:
Thanks for your thoughts Spongebob & Zingari. My budget puts me in an early 991 - probably a 2012 model. Should I assume the car should be nearly perfect at this age? I've always purchased older models, so expected a bit of wear - but want to make sure I am getting the best from the OPC.

I'm pleased to hear there's possible wiggle room on OPC prices.

I asked an OPC informally about my car previously, and they confirmed with a non-OPC rebuild they wouldn't be allowed to re-sell it, even if it was otherwise spanking condition with low miles. Hence they would offer me a fairly poor px value. I'll get it up for sale privately whilst I wait for the right 991 to come along - I best get a move on, given it's a cab!


Rob I would get an ad on here and start a thread about selling it as there are always guys on here looking for hartech rebuilt 997.1s and there seems to be a thread almost every week about someone or another on the hunt for one.


Thanks Phil - I will do just that. If you see anyone after a 997.1 manual C2S cab, send them my way Smile


will do mate Thumb good luck and keep up posted on both the sale and purchase Thumb
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spongebob squarepants
Sepang


Joined: 20 Dec 2009
Posts: 2900
Location: Manchester and Iraq


PostPosted: Mon Jul 24, 2017 5:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rob personally I'd expect the absolute best from an OPC even on a 5 year old car, plus the 991 is plentiful. it has to be to a set minimum standard, see here- for example the bodywork

http://www.porschewilmslow.co.uk/approved-pre-owned-cars

However things like minimum 3 mm tread are open to negotiation, if it were me with 3 mm I'd want a new tyre!.... and the servicing due within 3 months I'd be thinking you need to service this unless it's been done Like last week!

As Phil says get yours advertised on here Hartech rebuild is rare amongst a sea of cars without it thumbsup
_________________
997.2 Carrera 4S PDK (Herman white)
EX 997.2 Carrera S PDK
EX 993 C2 manual in guards red
EX 997 C2 gen 2 PDK
EX 993 Targa
EX 993 Carrera 4 manual
EX 996 3.4 Cabriolet
 
  
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scoot
Monza


Joined: 09 Mar 2015
Posts: 164
Location: Berkshire


PostPosted: Mon Jul 24, 2017 6:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rob some good advice here. I moved from a 997.1 to a 991.1 from OPC Silverstone 18 months ago. The part-ex was OK would have got a much more private, just didn't want the hassle especially as it was my daily driver. OPC customer service and sales experience was excellent. They pushed my 997 out via a non OPC dealer in their empire. Finance on used not great APR so you are better off with third party someone like Oracle who seem to be more competitive for used not so much for new.

Warranty is a great plus as mine went in in the first couple of months with a split coolant expansion tank at another OPC and is about to go in this week for an electric window button replacement (well hoping its covered).
_________________
Dave
991.2 GTS MY2018, Manual, Miami Blue
EX - 991.1 C2S MY2013, Manual, Sports Chrono, PSE, Guards Red
EX - 997.1 C2S MY2005, Manual, Sport Chrono, Atlas Grey
 
  
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sideways
Trainee


Joined: 17 Oct 2016
Posts: 52
Location: Surrey


PostPosted: Tue Jul 25, 2017 7:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

As above on all points.
From my experience of OPC I would expect the car body work to be perfect in every way.
On tyres my OPC always tried to recommend replacement at nearer 5mm so I would expect that as a minimum.
The have wiggle room on the finance. I've only ever bought new from Porsche but they are always prepared to shift down. Doubt you would get lower than mid to high 7s at the moment though.
Try Lombard for finance as well. I got a stupid low rate on my 991 recently.
What fun hunting for the right 991 Very Happy
Best of luck.
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Rob325114
Spa-Francorchamps


Joined: 12 Dec 2015
Posts: 278



PostPosted: Tue Jul 25, 2017 7:53 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks all, some great advice here. Plan of action as follows:

1. Put my car up for sale on here, PH and Autotrader.

2. Secure external finance "in principle" - I'm seeing 5.3% to 7.3% available at some brokers. I would expect to be at the lower end of that bracket.

3. Keep my eye out for a strong 991 that fits my requirements

4. If 3 comes before 1 is completed, consider cost of holding two cars for a few months vs. loss on px

As an aside, I want to make my own car excellent for sale: Can anyone recommend a good place to get turbo alloys refurbished in London? Diamond cut of course Rolling Eyes
_________________
Current: Agate Grey 991.1 C2S Coupe, PDK
Ex: Black 997.1 Hartech'd C2S Cab, manual
Ex: Silver Citroen C2 GT, manual
Ex: Blue Ford Fiesta Zetec S 1.6, manual
 
  
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Rob325114
Spa-Francorchamps


Joined: 12 Dec 2015
Posts: 278



PostPosted: Tue Jul 25, 2017 7:56 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

scoot wrote:
Rob some good advice here. I moved from a 997.1 to a 991.1 from OPC Silverstone 18 months ago. The part-ex was OK would have got a much more private, just didn't want the hassle especially as it was my daily driver. OPC customer service and sales experience was excellent. They pushed my 997 out via a non OPC dealer in their empire. Finance on used not great APR so you are better off with third party someone like Oracle who seem to be more competitive for used not so much for new.

Warranty is a great plus as mine went in in the first couple of months with a split coolant expansion tank at another OPC and is about to go in this week for an electric window button replacement (well hoping its covered).


Thanks Scoot. If I brought the car directly from an OPC that was quite far away, rather than getting my local OPC to bring it in, do you find the local OPC is then not as keen to help if things need fixing on the warranty? Or are they usually pretty good?

I like the idea of going to informally view a vehicle on it's home turf, rather than feeling like I'm obliged to buy something because my local OPC has gone through the trouble of bringing it to the centre.
_________________
Current: Agate Grey 991.1 C2S Coupe, PDK
Ex: Black 997.1 Hartech'd C2S Cab, manual
Ex: Silver Citroen C2 GT, manual
Ex: Blue Ford Fiesta Zetec S 1.6, manual
 
  
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apollokre1d
Indianapolis


Joined: 06 Nov 2012
Posts: 2343
Location: United Kingdom


PostPosted: Tue Jul 25, 2017 7:57 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rob325114 wrote:
Can anyone recommend a good place to get turbo alloys refurbished in London? Diamond cut of course Rolling Eyes


Got to be Chris at excel wheels, he will drop off a loan pair of wheels while he sorts yours out.
 
  
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Rob325114
Spa-Francorchamps


Joined: 12 Dec 2015
Posts: 278



PostPosted: Tue Jul 25, 2017 8:04 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

apollokre1d wrote:
Rob325114 wrote:
Can anyone recommend a good place to get turbo alloys refurbished in London? Diamond cut of course Rolling Eyes


Got to be Chris at excel wheels, he will drop off a loan pair of wheels while he sorts yours out.


Thumb Legend; have emailed
_________________
Current: Agate Grey 991.1 C2S Coupe, PDK
Ex: Black 997.1 Hartech'd C2S Cab, manual
Ex: Silver Citroen C2 GT, manual
Ex: Blue Ford Fiesta Zetec S 1.6, manual
 
  
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scoot
Monza


Joined: 09 Mar 2015
Posts: 164
Location: Berkshire


PostPosted: Tue Jul 25, 2017 10:47 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rob325114 wrote:
scoot wrote:
Rob some good advice here. I moved from a 997.1 to a 991.1 from OPC Silverstone 18 months ago. The part-ex was OK would have got a much more private, just didn't want the hassle especially as it was my daily driver. OPC customer service and sales experience was excellent. They pushed my 997 out via a non OPC dealer in their empire. Finance on used not great APR so you are better off with third party someone like Oracle who seem to be more competitive for used not so much for new.

Warranty is a great plus as mine went in in the first couple of months with a split coolant expansion tank at another OPC and is about to go in this week for an electric window button replacement (well hoping its covered).


Thanks Scoot. If I brought the car directly from an OPC that was quite far away, rather than getting my local OPC to bring it in, do you find the local OPC is then not as keen to help if things need fixing on the warranty? Or are they usually pretty good?

I like the idea of going to informally view a vehicle on it's home turf, rather than feeling like I'm obliged to buy something because my local OPC has gone through the trouble of bringing it to the centre.


No problems with warranty work at any OPC, I would have preferred to use supplying dealer as they supplied and maintained the car from new, however logistics and time doesn't allow for this so used Reading and Guildford for the two jobs so far. Main reason for choosing Silverstone was they were just so good at getting back to me and discussing my interests in the car. I had three cars in mind and this was the second furthest away, part of the problem I had is I was after a manual, which seriously reduced my choice of cars with options and price that fitted my requirements. It was fun looking. Hope this helps.
_________________
Dave
991.2 GTS MY2018, Manual, Miami Blue
EX - 991.1 C2S MY2013, Manual, Sports Chrono, PSE, Guards Red
EX - 997.1 C2S MY2005, Manual, Sport Chrono, Atlas Grey
 
  
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spongebob squarepants
Sepang


Joined: 20 Dec 2009
Posts: 2900
Location: Manchester and Iraq


PostPosted: Tue Jul 25, 2017 11:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

scoot wrote:
Rob325114 wrote:
scoot wrote:
Rob some good advice here. I moved from a 997.1 to a 991.1 from OPC Silverstone 18 months ago. The part-ex was OK would have got a much more private, just didn't want the hassle especially as it was my daily driver. OPC customer service and sales experience was excellent. They pushed my 997 out via a non OPC dealer in their empire. Finance on used not great APR so you are better off with third party someone like Oracle who seem to be more competitive for used not so much for new.

Warranty is a great plus as mine went in in the first couple of months with a split coolant expansion tank at another OPC and is about to go in this week for an electric window button replacement (well hoping its covered).


Thanks Scoot. If I brought the car directly from an OPC that was quite far away, rather than getting my local OPC to bring it in, do you find the local OPC is then not as keen to help if things need fixing on the warranty? Or are they usually pretty good?

I like the idea of going to informally view a vehicle on it's home turf, rather than feeling like I'm obliged to buy something because my local OPC has gone through the trouble of bringing it to the centre.


No problems with warranty work at any OPC, I would have preferred to use supplying dealer as they supplied and maintained the car from new, however logistics and time doesn't allow for this so used Reading and Guildford for the two jobs so far. Main reason for choosing Silverstone was they were just so good at getting back to me and discussing my interests in the car. I had three cars in mind and this was the second furthest away, part of the problem I had is I was after a manual, which seriously reduced my choice of cars with options and price that fitted my requirements. It was fun looking. Hope this helps.


+1 on the warranty- with a main dealer and warranty its in any OPC's interest to carry out the warranty work, as long as its approved with Porsche, the dealer is then getting work paid for by the Porsche warranty provider, its win win. On my last 997 the OPC seemed desperate to find things wrong even carrying out free inspections, for example the AC not quite cool enough, next thing full overhaul all FOC, turned out an issue with the condensors, the OPC just had to prove it wasn't damage to them and bobs your uncle sorted. IMHO OPC maintained cars will always be the best due to the above.
_________________
997.2 Carrera 4S PDK (Herman white)
EX 997.2 Carrera S PDK
EX 993 C2 manual in guards red
EX 997 C2 gen 2 PDK
EX 993 Targa
EX 993 Carrera 4 manual
EX 996 3.4 Cabriolet
 
  
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askgeez
Suzuka


Joined: 05 Apr 2015
Posts: 1230
Location: London/ Essex


PostPosted: Tue Jul 25, 2017 12:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

This time a month ago. OPC east london improved £1k on my PX and took £1k of their (used) £63k 997 GTS puh

They were going to punt my 2006 PX to auction Sad

Without any effort at all they improved the 8.2% to 5.9% on Porsche solutions Thumb (I did get a quote from 3rd party specialist finance firm, and they said they couldnt beat by much)

Squeezed a pair of new front tyres out of them, but nothing else
_________________
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Rob325114
Spa-Francorchamps


Joined: 12 Dec 2015
Posts: 278



PostPosted: Tue Jul 25, 2017 12:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

askgeez wrote:
This time a month ago. OPC east london improved £1k on my PX and took £1k of their (used) £63k 997 GTS puh

They were going to punt my 2006 PX to auction Sad

Without any effort at all they improved the 8.2% to 5.9% on Porsche solutions Thumb (I did get a quote from 3rd party specialist finance firm, and they said they couldnt beat by much)

Squeezed a pair of new front tyres out of them, but nothing else


Incredibly useful feedback there. 5.9% is about what I am seeing externally - so if they could get down to that figure on finance I'd be keen to consider keeping it all at OPC. The problem is, it seems the rates get worse, the bigger the deposit you put down. It's like there's a minimum amount of interest they want to make - perhaps to cover fixed costs.
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Current: Agate Grey 991.1 C2S Coupe, PDK
Ex: Black 997.1 Hartech'd C2S Cab, manual
Ex: Silver Citroen C2 GT, manual
Ex: Blue Ford Fiesta Zetec S 1.6, manual
 
  
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biggriff
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PostPosted: Tue Jul 25, 2017 4:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

If its less than £25k Sainsburys were offering 2.8% with a Nectar card.
 
  
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