Damping plates

davidjf7 · 21 Oct 2016

Hi chaps

A word of warning and a plea for help!

Started the job of replacing my discs and pads, and when removing one of the damping plates, one of the locating pins didn't come out with the plate and is now stuck in the caliper :frustrated:

Any ideas what I can do?

Thanks

Thefinn · 21 Oct 2016

I drilled a thin hole in mine then screwed in a larger screw to give me something to pull on, just don't drill too far! Don't forget wd40 to loosen things up as well

davidjf7 · 21 Oct 2016

Thefinn said:
I drilled a thin hole in mine then screwed in a larger screw to give me something to pull on, just don't drill too far! Don't forget wd40 to loosen things up as well

Thanks for your reply!

Mine has a screw in it (the locating pin has a captive thread and seems to be secured to the plate by this screw, with the screw head somehow being glued to the plate back).

I tried tightening the screw in an attempt to loosed the pin in the cylinder but the cylinder turned round too.

Then tried partly unscrewing the screw, getting a pair of pliers on the head and trying to pull it out, but no joy. Seems pretty solid in there.

Soaked it with wd40 and will try again tomorrow I guess :nooo:

deMort · 21 Oct 2016

Yup its a pain when that happens , usually only one of the 2 " bungs " for want of a better word seizes into the caliper piston.

If you can get the screw out of it you can remove the bung from the new backing plate and screw it onto the seized one.

If it wont come out at all after wd40 etc then you have 2 choices ..

1 / caliper off and send to an engineering company for them to remove it .

2 / remove the same bung from the new backing plate , hammer flat the scew hole in it and fit as it is , try to line it up then fit pads .

Probably not a popular answer but this comes down to cost at the end of the day .. its there to stop squeek and knocking .

davidjf7 · 21 Oct 2016

Thanks Demort :thumb:

I'm sure I could get the screw/bolt out so that's a good backup plan to remove the 'bung' from a new plate and put the new screw through.

My fear was having to remove the caliber and send it away.

Fingers crossed I can get it to move tomorrow.

The ones on the other side just fell out

c:

monster · 21 Oct 2016

Hi David,

You may have read in the thread I posted yesterday about my recent issue with my brakes - I have just had all my calipers off the car and although my pads didn't need replacing this time, all the shims fell apart so I set out to replace them.

The rears are a different design to the fronts and don't have this problem, but the front shim carriers often stick within the pistons and are difficult to remove - I had two that would not come out on mine and were seized tight.

Since I was sending my calipers off for refurbishment and broken bleed screw removal to Pro-Calipers, I asked Thomas if he could remove the two seized shim carriers and he said it would be easier since he has them in bits to simply replace these two pistons, which he did in this instance - if I recall correctly they were about £25 each.

Now had I not been sending the calipers to him, I had planned the following method of which I am quite confident would have enabled me to successfully extract the two seized shim carriers:

1) Remove the philips head screw that holds the shim to the shim carrier that you see in the centre of the round carrier. As you have said you are doing - soak this overnight in WD40 and then get a good fitting driver on it held in a wrench to give you access, as its not possible to get anything other than a stubby screw driver in. I got both of the screws in mine out using this method.

2) Once you have this screw out, you need to make up a simple extracting jig, which simply needs be a short flat metal bar approx 20mm wide, 5-10mm deep and long enough to span the width of the piston. Then drill a hole in the centre that is a clearance size for the screw thread that you have extracted from the shim carrier.

3) Find a large socket (or similar) that is greater than the dia of the shim carrier that will sit on the piston face. Obtain a longer bolt with the same thread as the one you removed long enough to reach through the hole in the little jig you have made and through the socket. Wind this bolt into the thread in the shim carrier - wind this in until the head pulls up to the jig and keep winding and this should then extract the shim carrier up and out of the piston.

Or - send it Thomas of Pro-Calipes! - see my other thread 'Braking Bad'

I would also advise smearing a little bit of copper slip or similar around the new thread carriers before you slide them into the piston bores - I did this on mine yesterday.

Good luck with it! :thumbs:

davidjf7 · 21 Oct 2016

Monster, you're a legend. What a great forum this is. Some great replies from really knowledgeable people willing to share their experience :thumbs:

I did read your thread and was impressed with your experience with pro-calipers.

Will try your recommendation, and if that fails, will go to pro-calipers!

Glad you got your car sorted. Reading it reminded me of driving home in my station car (ford puma). Had to brake hard for a cyclist, then next time I went to use the brakes the pedal went to the floor. Brake pipe had corroded and burst so had to do 15 miles with no brakes. A good lesson in anticipating the road ahead :grin:

monster · 21 Oct 2016

davidjf7 said:
Monster, you're a legend. What a great forum this is. Some great replies from really knowledgeable people willing to share their experience :thumbs:

I did read your thread and was impressed with your experience with pro-calipers.

Will try your recommendation, and if that fails, will go to pro-calipers!

Glad you got your car sorted. Reading it reminded me of driving home in my station car (ford puma). Had to brake hard for a cyclist, then next time I went to use the brakes the pedal went to the floor. Brake pipe had corroded and burst so had to do 15 miles with no brakes. A good lesson in anticipating the road ahead :grin:

Wow that is scary - i guess the pipe was on its way out and when you stomped on the brakes to avoid the cyclist - this was the final straw that raised the pressure sufficiently to burst though the corroding pipe! - in fact the other night when I felt my pedal go long, it was during some heavy braking down from high speeds, so similar thing - higher than usual pressure exerted within the system finds the weak point which in our cases was a corroding area of pipe! scary stuff!

Good luck with extracting the shims - if you have any questions post up here or pm! cheers.

davidjf7 · 24 Oct 2016

monster said:
davidjf7 said:

Monster, you're a legend. What a great forum this is. Some great replies from really knowledgeable people willing to share their experience :thumbs:

I did read your thread and was impressed with your experience with pro-calipers.

Will try your recommendation, and if that fails, will go to pro-calipers!

Glad you got your car sorted. Reading it reminded me of driving home in my station car (ford puma). Had to brake hard for a cyclist, then next time I went to use the brakes the pedal went to the floor. Brake pipe had corroded and burst so had to do 15 miles with no brakes. A good lesson in anticipating the road ahead :grin:

Click to expand...

Wow that is scary - i guess the pipe was on its way out and when you stomped on the brakes to avoid the cyclist - this was the final straw that raised the pressure sufficiently to burst though the corroding pipe! - in fact the other night when I felt my pedal go long, it was during some heavy braking down from high speeds, so similar thing - higher than usual pressure exerted within the system finds the weak point which in our cases was a corroding area of pipe! scary stuff!

Good luck with extracting the shims - if you have any questions post up here or pm! cheers.

Exactly! I have to say that driving without brakes is an excellent lesson in anticipating the road ahead. Maybe it should be part of the driving test :?: :grin:

So, I got the near side all rebuilt and ready to go. It really is an easy and satisfying job to do, (if nothing goes wrong :frustrated: )

I tried to get that pin out from the offside caliper, but no joy. I didn't have a proper bolt in the right size, so I'm hoping to get one today and try again tonight. It does seem pretty well wedged in there though. Got the caliper to lay on its side and soaked it with penetrating oil yesterday afternoon, so hopefully that will have some effect.

If this doesn't work, it will either be an attempt to fix a new backing plate to the stuck pin (Demort's suggestion), or sending off to pro-calipers.

Anyone know if removing the caliper is relatively easy? Can I just remove the connecting pipe and bung it so that I don't need to bleed the whole system?

monster · 24 Oct 2016

Thats a good idea of Demort's to simply screw the new shim into the old carrier if its corroded in place, will enable you to quickly get it all back together.

Caliper comes off really easy - yes just bung the pipe and it will be fine - use a golf tee or match or similar with a bit of ptfe tape around to or even a bit of rag - just don't press your brake pedal!

Caliper will be far easier to work on it when its on a bench for getting out the seized shim carrier!

Martian · 24 Oct 2016

Also worth smearing a bit of copper grease inside the piston where the plate sits to make removal easy next time.

Changed all my (PCCB) pads last year and luckily all mine were easy to remove.

deMort · 24 Oct 2016

Might be worth getting some brake pipe clamps .. i use the below ones on the closest flexi pipe ...

davidjf7 · 25 Oct 2016

Thanks again Monster - have managed to get a bolt that may do the job, just need to get some time this week to have a go at it.

Martian, great tip and exactly what I've done on the other side. I read that they go in 'dry' but after my experience they won't be!

Thanks Demort - does that clamp around the rubber hose? I guess it won't damage the piping?

deMort · 25 Oct 2016

Yup .. the left side unclips and you open it up and put around a rubber pipe .. brakes in this case .

No it doesn,t damage the brake pipe , It will if you clamp the copper pipe though lol

There are many types available , thats just what i use .

Does it last ? ive had my pair since i was an apprentise .. 35 years old

davidjf7 · 27 Oct 2016

Thanks Demort, really useful to know :thumb:

Fortunately I don't need it, because last night I managed to extract the old pin using Monster's genius suggestion of socket, metal plate and bolt!

Over the moon to finally get it out and I can now get on with putting the new disc and pads in.

Huge thanks Monster :thumbs: :worship:

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