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991.1 GT3 Global Recall from 'multi car fires', UPDATED 2017

wizard993 said:
Possibly just one of the reasons why they don't use this engine in the 2013 RSR's.

If it's letting go at high RPM and spilling oil onto a hot exhaust they will be in serious trouble with this engine.

Lets hope it is a minor issue.

There is a lot of rule volatility in GT racing at the moment - Porsche are sticking with the old engine (which remains homologated for a good few years yet) as they are waiting to see what the best way to go is before committing to an expensive development programme. It is not impossible that the racing cars may have to go to Turbos, and this explains why they are distancing from the GT3 label on the racing cars. Other than the 991 GT3 Cup cars, the 991 is just a 911 RSR and 911 GT America in the current line up...

As for the road 991 GT3s self immolating - the version that I have seen so far is that it is a very minor problem with a straightforward retrofit in the oil system (think badly designed bracket - the fires so far have not been failures of the engine itself but rather ancillary. I hope that turns out to be the true story and if so is not going to be a major concern to owners).
 
nick w said:
Apparently there are also issues with the new
larger PCCB rotors....."there may be trouble
ahead".... :dont know:

Which is great news for all of the new GT3 people on the PH thread buying into 991s that have convinced themselves that they have to get Ceramics despite all of the warnings from that a range of people posted on there over the last 9 years :paperbag:
 
Disco said:
wizard993 said:
the Motorsports engineers must be gutted as they have a reputation of getting GT and RS's right, straight out the box.

Not really. With the 997, the Gen1 needed a different ARB (part even now superseded in the parts catalogue) and the Gen2 has fragile wheel hubs and a weak diff. Both also acquired an unwelcome appetite for rear brakes, compounded by the necessity (introduced for no particular reason) to remove the rear callipers in order to change the pads. There were also a small number of 997.1 GT3s that inexplicably blew up their engines (supposedly QC problems with the con-rods I think, but Cunno has the full story on that). Oh, and several 4 litres lunched their engines due to an air box problem that resulted in a recall. The only one that they didn't ***** up in some way was the 997.1 GT2 AFAIK?

The 996.1 had weak gearbox synchros, slightly inadequate gearbox cooling and was slightly under-braked too, making the 996.2 GT3/2/RS their finest hour. That said, the 996RS had paint issues on the carbon parts and wheel lacquer problems too (both resulting in widespread incidences of yellowing, bubbling and wheel corrosion after only a couple of years), so wasn't faultless...

Obviously all of the weaknesses only came to light quite some time after the cars were actually bought by people though. The concerning part is that with the cures for the issues seem to be getting successively more expensive...

The worry for the 991 is that it has so many completely new systems with significantly more complicated and expensive elements than previous cars that it may be financial suicide to try to run one out of warranty.

:soapbox:

Of course highly stressed engines let go but when the thing also catches fire and you have a kid strapped in the passenger seat or someone with a disability then it becomes a whole new ball game.
 
This crop of fires is reputedly caused by a change in supplier of the bolts used to secure the engine oil/water heat exchanger frame to the engine which work loose & then the running engine dumps pressurised oil on a hot exhaust resulting in a nasty oil fire; anyone who has had one of those knows how hard they are to put out!

Affected cars are those produced in 2014 only, which is why we are only just beginning to hear about the problem as they are delivered to customers. Cars made last year do not exhibit the problem.

Allegedly :wink:
 
Roro said:
I think this is the first non-Mezger engine they've ever produced? The first engine they've produced from scratch?

Don't forget the M96 engines also (which as we all know by know wasn't very well produced).

~ Maxie
 
NXI20 said:
This crop of fires is reputedly caused by a change in supplier of the bolts used to secure the engine oil/water heat exchanger frame to the engine which work loose & then the running engine dumps pressurised oil on a hot exhaust resulting in a nasty oil fire; anyone who has had one of those knows how hard they are to put out!

Affected cars are those produced in 2014 only, which is why we are only just beginning to hear about the problem as they are delivered to customers. Cars made last year do not exhibit the problem.

Allegedly :wink:

still more bolts allegedly falling off :what:

surely after the 'last' problems they would have sorted that issue out :nooo:
 
As Porsche is subsumed into the maw of VW, I suspect we will see more examples of components that used to function perfectly suddenly letting the side down because a cost accountant or purchasing manager switched suppliers to save 2p.

I've seen it already with a small bit of plastic I ordered for the 993 in July. It was out of stock & awaiting a re-order from a new supplier and wasn't expected in until early December(!). Then I get the call in December to say it failed QC & they've kicked it back to the supplier to have another go. On Tuesday Porsche rang to say they'd finally got it in stock.

1 SMALL BIT OF PLASTIC FFS :frustrated:

I fully expect it not to fit, be the wrong colour or something equally annoying...
 
Not that I'm biased in any way...

But with the famous IMS/BS 'chocolate engine' fiascos of the 996/997 and now the very best and most expensive 991 they can offer going up in flames like a cheap Argos toaster...


...will the 993 go down in car history as the last well built 911 that Porsche made?

:whistle:
 
nick w said:
Apparently there are also issues with the new
larger PCCB rotors....."there may be trouble
ahead".... :dont know:

Which issues are these? :popcorn:
 
Maxie said:
Roro said:
I think this is the first non-Mezger engine they've ever produced? The first engine they've produced from scratch?

Don't forget the M96 engines also (which as we all know by know wasn't very well produced).

~ Maxie

By "they" I was referring to "Motorsport engineers" as per wizards post, not Porsche generally.
 
chimp911 said:
nick w said:
http://forums.rennlist.com/rennforums/991-gt3/800153-pccbs-replaced.html

:roll:

Oh dear :nooo: thanks for the link


NP ! :wink:
 
Disco said:
wizard993 said:
the Motorsports engineers must be gutted as they have a reputation of getting GT and RS's right, straight out the box.

Not really. With the 997, the Gen1 needed a different ARB (part even now superseded in the parts catalogue) and the Gen2 has fragile wheel hubs and a weak diff. Both also acquired an unwelcome appetite for rear brakes, compounded by the necessity (introduced for no particular reason) to remove the rear callipers in order to change the pads. There were also a small number of 997.1 GT3s that inexplicably blew up their engines (supposedly QC problems with the con-rods I think, but Cunno has the full story on that). Oh, and several 4 litres lunched their engines due to an air box problem that resulted in a recall. The only one that they didn't ***** up in some way was the 997.1 GT2 AFAIK?

The 996.1 had weak gearbox synchros, slightly inadequate gearbox cooling and was slightly under-braked too, making the 996.2 GT3/2/RS their finest hour. That said, the 996RS had paint issues on the carbon parts and wheel lacquer problems too (both resulting in widespread incidences of yellowing, bubbling and wheel corrosion after only a couple of years), so wasn't faultless...

Obviously all of the weaknesses only came to light quite some time after the cars were actually bought by people though. The concerning part is that with the cures for the issues seem to be getting successively more expensive...

The worry for the 991 is that it has so many completely new systems with significantly more complicated and expensive elements than previous cars that it may be financial suicide to try to run one out of warranty.

:soapbox:

Don't forget that the 3.8 and 4.0 gen 2 cars have a habit of rattling the selfs apart as well.
http://forums.rennlist.com/rennforums/997-gt2-gt3-forum/719338-gt3rs-2011-engine-problems.html

And there is always the coolent pipe issues on all of them.
 

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