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Massive mechanical failure. Not a good day...
- Thread starter jfb1977
- Start date
no f in water
New member
- Joined
- 19 Feb 2011
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- 18
Looks like the decision taken by the Porsche board to transfer control from the engineers to the bean counters may come back to bite them after all........ :hand:
Whilst my 993 is far from perfect (despite eye watering bills at every service interval :sad: ) I am sure I have read that production times for the 996 were 10% of those for the 993.
Whilst my 993 is far from perfect (despite eye watering bills at every service interval :sad: ) I am sure I have read that production times for the 996 were 10% of those for the 993.
Porsche are no worse than any other manufacturer who have had issues with engine design, and in some cases they're significantly better.
My own personal experience is with the 1ZZ Toyota engines which had problems with the pre-cats in the mk3 MR2 application. Toyota never admitted the issue despite a wealth of knowledge on it amongst various specialist forums across the world, even though there was an easy fix. They did offer replacement engines or contributions if you'd had naim dealer servicing though... Is this starting to sound quite similar yet?!
The cost of replacing an engine in the MR2 was roughly similar percentage-wise to replacing one in a 911, so it's a fair comparison IMHO. Manufacturers spend millions on engine R&D, and 99% of the time they get it right. Occasionally they'll make a mistake, but given that Porsche have been pretty generous (in my eyes) with their reparations to people who have been unfortunate to suffer issues, I think they should be commended rather than slated.
Granted that's coming from someone who has never suffered these issues, and a big part of me buying a gen2 car was to avoid any of this, and I do have a genuine sympathy for anyone who has suffered in the way the OP has. Every car has it's own foibles, some are minor, some not so much: As with everything in life, luck plays a huge part.
My own personal experience is with the 1ZZ Toyota engines which had problems with the pre-cats in the mk3 MR2 application. Toyota never admitted the issue despite a wealth of knowledge on it amongst various specialist forums across the world, even though there was an easy fix. They did offer replacement engines or contributions if you'd had naim dealer servicing though... Is this starting to sound quite similar yet?!
The cost of replacing an engine in the MR2 was roughly similar percentage-wise to replacing one in a 911, so it's a fair comparison IMHO. Manufacturers spend millions on engine R&D, and 99% of the time they get it right. Occasionally they'll make a mistake, but given that Porsche have been pretty generous (in my eyes) with their reparations to people who have been unfortunate to suffer issues, I think they should be commended rather than slated.
Granted that's coming from someone who has never suffered these issues, and a big part of me buying a gen2 car was to avoid any of this, and I do have a genuine sympathy for anyone who has suffered in the way the OP has. Every car has it's own foibles, some are minor, some not so much: As with everything in life, luck plays a huge part.
When I had some minor work done at my local OPC, asked them how many engine failures they have. The service manager was quite open, about 10-12 a year, of which 2-3 are 911s.
I wonder if anyone in the trade would have an idea of how many engines a Ferrari/Lotus/BMW M/AMG dealer need to change in a year. Unless anyone frequents those forums
I wonder if anyone in the trade would have an idea of how many engines a Ferrari/Lotus/BMW M/AMG dealer need to change in a year. Unless anyone frequents those forums
The other point to consider is the that of everyday reality vs forum obsession.
The majority of Porsche owners just don't know. What is particularly bizarre from my point of view (as someone who has observed various forums with varying degrees of incredulity) is that those that have such passion for the brand/car/ethos/whatever you want to call it, have the greatest propensity the run Porsche down and get into petty arguments with fellow enthusiasts. And not everything I have read falls into the category of healthy debate!
Some folks are just plain nasty - PH is worse than here. I daren't post on there for fear that some smart-arse with a grudge will call me something nasty because his mudflap fell of once and it wasn't replaced by a bikini-clad lovely within 60 seconds of the dreadful event.
Where do you go to find a place where Porsche cars, parts, service, dealers, distributors and the such are consistently run down and pilloried? Why, a Porsche forum of course.
I'm sure I'm going to get the 'healthy debate' argument now, but seriously - how much attention do you think you get from those that really matter?
911uk, like similar sites/forums/groups, is in a minority. Let's face it, even Official Porsche Clubs have little or no influence, and are humoured by the Brand, which is far more interested in how many Cayennes and Panameras it can sell to the Chinese. They are not concerned that you are no longer able to obtain the correct Mobil 1 sticker for your 1996 993 (I think it's great that the cars generate this level of passion/attention to detail).
...and before you shoot me down and go on the offensive, I'm a fan. I've loved these things for as long as I can remember, and I go to the garage for a quiet moment just to look at mine (car).
Yes, RMS/IMS/Bore failure really kills the ownership experience, but there are so many things in life that we could really do without too, and we just get on with it.
It rains. Porsches can break down. The sun always shines on TV.
Carry on.
The majority of Porsche owners just don't know. What is particularly bizarre from my point of view (as someone who has observed various forums with varying degrees of incredulity) is that those that have such passion for the brand/car/ethos/whatever you want to call it, have the greatest propensity the run Porsche down and get into petty arguments with fellow enthusiasts. And not everything I have read falls into the category of healthy debate!
Some folks are just plain nasty - PH is worse than here. I daren't post on there for fear that some smart-arse with a grudge will call me something nasty because his mudflap fell of once and it wasn't replaced by a bikini-clad lovely within 60 seconds of the dreadful event.
Where do you go to find a place where Porsche cars, parts, service, dealers, distributors and the such are consistently run down and pilloried? Why, a Porsche forum of course.
I'm sure I'm going to get the 'healthy debate' argument now, but seriously - how much attention do you think you get from those that really matter?
911uk, like similar sites/forums/groups, is in a minority. Let's face it, even Official Porsche Clubs have little or no influence, and are humoured by the Brand, which is far more interested in how many Cayennes and Panameras it can sell to the Chinese. They are not concerned that you are no longer able to obtain the correct Mobil 1 sticker for your 1996 993 (I think it's great that the cars generate this level of passion/attention to detail).
...and before you shoot me down and go on the offensive, I'm a fan. I've loved these things for as long as I can remember, and I go to the garage for a quiet moment just to look at mine (car).
Yes, RMS/IMS/Bore failure really kills the ownership experience, but there are so many things in life that we could really do without too, and we just get on with it.
It rains. Porsches can break down. The sun always shines on TV.
Carry on.
c4srmsims, thanks for the sanity check. You are right, but the PH and Porsche forums just reflect the fact that humanity will like to share a tale of woe slightly more often than they are motivated to share a tale of joy. In between the amusing spats, there is a wealth of knowledge to be gained. Yesterday it took me ten internet minutes to locate the likely problem with my VW Polo runabout and I avoided all the hassle of going near a garage. This resource just wasn't even dream t about 15 years ago, all you had was monthly enthusiast magazines and clubs, although with less knowledge in circulation, maybe owners worried less, who knows! On this thread alone there are a dozen or more tips on Porsche ownership well worth knowing.
stokie1 said:
I'm STILL waiting for Byfleet to take the thing apart. I was told that they should be starting this yesterday. Ironically, they only have a limited number of engine stands and all were in use due to the number of repairs / replacements they have on the books at the moment, so they've been unable to get to mine.
I know these guys are busy, but it's damn frustrating. I want my car back and it's been with them 10 days and they haven't even taken it to bits yet so we can assign blame.
Am trying to remain calm and understanding but I want to get things moving... :nooo:
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