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993 brakes/handling

Craig Dent

New member
Joined
18 Jun 2003
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10
Bought a 993 1996 in early Aug having tried quite a few previously ( one from Oakhills who I notice have been the subect of enquiries fairly recently). I found all the 993's particularly "fidgetty" and 2 of the cars juddered badly under not really severe braking.

So, I purchased my least fidgetty car, Met red, 50K kms, LHD one owner Germany, one owner UK with main dealer service history. Replaced rear tyres with original 17" spec Continentals(£104+vat), had wheels specially balanced ( nearly died at £20 per wheel) set off for continent and guess what? Soon as I started to use the brakes, Judder Judder. And the discs & pads were replaced by HR Owen, Hatlield less than 5000k's ago and looked like new as they should!

Jeeeez, these cars are built by the company which has won Le Mans how many times? and yet in my short but fairly concentrated experience of the marque, they present consistently an unacceptable problem ----and if you really want to know how serious, I've just come back from an excursion to the Dolomites and the trip included the Grimsel, Susten, Oberal, Bernina, Julier, Tonale, Campo Carlo Magna passes and many others of lesser stature--------------and juddering brakes under such driving conditions ain't funny.

Does anybody have the same consistent experience and is there a solution? I'm about to replace front discs and pads but will not be at all gruntled if they again revert to a juddering mass after only another 5000kms.

Oh, yes, the fidgetty nature? Concentration is soooooo high at over say 110mph that driving becomes a bore, especially when Renault Lagunas and the like seem to just eat up the miles. Yes, the car is short and will therefore not be exceptional in the stability department but is there a suspension set up / tweak (like castor angle adjustment?) which will stabilise the steering just a little bit? Both self and wife came independantly to the conclusion that consistent 125mph driving is more achievable and MUCH more relaxing in our old Audi A6 Turbo Diesel-----------but it doesn't "turn in" quite the same on the mountain passes and those impossibly short overtaking oportunities just don't exist.

Finally --- in 3000 miles of varied driving the 993 averaged 24mpg ------unbelievable!

Any help to sort out what is potentially a great car would be appreciated

Craig Dent


Migration info. Legacy thread was 8455
 
Craig,

You car doesn't sound right but then I am not sure if you are translating a "driving experience" into "fidgety". What I mean to say is that any 911 is going to feel more alive than laguna or A6, that why we love em.

Brakes could be warped?

Suspension wise, the standard set up at 50000kms should not be worn but the geometry might be out, get a good specialist to check it out, you might find that someone has fitted lowering springs and left the stock shocks on for example.

I have just had a Roock full suspension kit fitted and it has transformed the car (for me) some would undoubtedly say that the ride is now to harsh.

I wonder if you are not really appreciating the way the car feels and are translating it as though there is something wrong.

I can't think of any car that I would rather go long distance in. or short for that matter.

Migration info. Legacy thread was 8459
 
I've had my 97 targa now for about 6 months. Mine to often feels 'jittery' especially on poor road surfaces. I have put this down to the decreased rigidity of the targa body.

However, I'm now thinking that it might need the 'four wheel alignment' checked.

Anyone else had this done in similar circumstances and noted a significant difference?

As regards the brakes, could this be the ABS kicking in?


Migration info. Legacy thread was 8462
 
Craig,

Something is badly wrong with the setup of the suspension by the sound of it. As Poon says, you need it checked by a good Independant Specialist (don't bother with a main dealer for a 993). Whereabouts are you ?

As to the brakes it should not be the ABS making the juddering unless you are really hammering them. Even on trackdays when I have braked very late into corners and the ABS kicked in it was little more than a small judder. Again, a Specialist can check it for you.

Sorry to be so vauge but without driving the car it's impossible to give an accurate answer.


Migration info. Legacy thread was 8464
 
25 yrs of circuit racing in (mainly)historic Astons / Masers & other stuff gives me a fair insite into the characteristics of cooked brakes / feel of ABS "judder" etc. It really feels like warped discs although I have not yet had time to put a dial guage to the discs to do a test. My concern is the fact that 2 of the cars I tried had the same prob and that my own car very quickly developed the same symptoms -----and I wasn't late braking ( although eventually, late, very hard, braking became the only way to supress the discomfort and consternation caused by the judder). Should not a high quality disc, presumably Zimmerman or Brembo(?) have a significantly longer life under normal road use than 5000kms?

The fidgetiness encountered is straight-line motorway stuff and at 120 plus I don't expect this from a Porsche ---- a lively feel is an altogether different thing which is what I would and do expect.

Since there is a general suggestion that the suspenders might be out I've contacted Rodley Motors in Bradford ( Richard Dawson is the proprietor with whom I used to race F3 ) who has just bought a fortune's worth of alignment kit and will check the geometry for me---- and for those with a need in Yorks tel no is 07785 363580 direct to the boss.

As for lowered suspension, that does seem a possibility --- the car does appear to be on the low side and as one repondent suggests, if simply lowered without making full compensatory adjustments elsewhere, it could cause a problem.

Thank yopu to everbody who responded---- very kind to take the time and trouble.

Craig Dent


Migration info. Legacy thread was 8471
 
Craig,

I also had "juddering" on my brakes. Turned out to be minor corosion on the inside of the discs - quite a common problem on drilled discs apparantly.

But no need for new discs. Completely cured by skimming.




Migration info. Legacy thread was 8473
 
993's tend to need regulary suspension re-alignment and also benefit from it massively.


Migration info. Legacy thread was 8477
 
Thanks Vic and James --- THAT puts my mind at rest, just to know

a)I'm not dreaming that the cars I've tried are below par

b) that somebody else has experienced the same trouble

c) I'm not going to sell it immediately as a sub-standard would-be kinda supercar

d)I'm not going to live on dissappointed in a vehicle manufacturer I have held in the highest esteem for many years

Craig

end of correspondence for me anyway---thanks to all




Migration info. Legacy thread was 8484
 

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