Convertible water leaks

When we had heavy rain at the start of the year I realised that I had water getting into the rear seat area on both sides of my car. Given it is parked outside all year round (I have no garage), I did what I could to dry it out at the time and put a car cover over to prevent matters getting worse. As we have had some decent weather during lockdown, I have since removed the rear liners and cleaned out the drainage channels (which were a little gunked up but not blocked. I was also looking at a couple of niggles with the hood and had removed rear quarter trim and have since removed the rear carpet to get it dried out properly.

I then started trying to track down the leaks in earnest. With the assistance of my daughter, we poured a few gallons of water over the sides of the hood and I found no water getting anywhere it shouldn't. Water running through the hoppers inside the rear quarters and down and out through the drainage holes in the rear wheel arches. I left the rear stripped out as no way was I going to reassemble everything without getting to the bottom of the issues.

When we had rain a couple of days ago I noticed that there were indeed leaks, squeezed my 6' 6'' frame into the rear of the car and tried to see what was happening.

Problem 1. Drivers Side Leak. I figured out that I have a leak from one of the hood seals on drivers side. It appears to come out of the joint between the rearmost seal and the middle seal. I put a plastic container under the joint from which the leak seemed to originate and the following morning found about 1cm of water in the tub. Problem 1 identified if not solved I thought? However, after much heavier rain last night, the plastic tub is empty - no water! It seems that the leak from this seal is intermittent. One thing that does not look right is the gap between the middle and rear seal (See pictures) albeit, the seals themselves both look fine. I am not sure that there is any adjustment in the fitment of these seals so not sure where to go with this next. Anyone ever had leaks from these seals albeit the seals look fine? I would go ahead and replace both rear and middle seals but aside from not being able to get them during lockdown, the cost for the pair is over £500 and I'm loath to do this should the issue be related to that gap. As an aside, has anyone replaced these seals? Is it a simple job?

Problem 2. Passenger side leak. The leak on the passenger side seems to come from behind the water drip pan/hopper; not the hopper itself. The hopper itself is draining happily and I popped a bit of garden hose on the upper drain of the collection tray (which is normally the corrugated pipe directed into the hopper) to check that this was also running (which it is; not much comes out this one). It really seems that the leak is coming from behind the water collection tray/drip pan/hopper and given its position I cannot for the life of me figure out where this s coming from. Again, anyone have any ideas?

sorry I can't really help identify the location of your leaks but I use Sonax GummiPfleger on all my roof seals to keep them clean and soft and maintain their elasticity

https://www.amazon.co.uk/SONAX-0340...e&qid=1588244870&sprefix=gummi,aps,157&sr=8-3

it also removes any squeaks if they occur.

Problem 1 looks like one of the seals has moved. Check either end of the two seals to see which one looks out and compare with the opposite side. Dont buy new ones, looks like one's just slipped.

Alex said:

Problem 1 looks like one of the seals has moved. Check either end of the two seals to see which one looks out and compare with the opposite side. Dont buy new ones, looks like one's just slipped.

Click to expand...

That's a promising thought - thank you. Obvious question: How do I slide/move the seal? Do I need to remove from the car or can I do this in situ with hood partially open?

The one that runs along the top of the window just pulls out. Its like a dobe tail in a slot. Check theres not a screw in the end though holding it in. Cant fully remember.

1 / Open the roof half way .. look at that panal and see if its loose .. X2 torx screws , T 30 i think and it's not uncommon for them to be loose .

1 / See link , no.17 is a seal i know can cause leaks if its missing but thats on the front section so have a look to see if you can identify no.13 as that seems to be the same thing but for your section thats leaking .

https://www.deroure.com/diagrams.asp?MAK=3&MDL=26&TBL=2901&SMA=&SMO=0&ST=&SC=0

1/ If none of the above then try a rubber lubricant on the seals each side.

1 / If your picture is when the roof is closed then that's very wrong .. loose i would have thought .


2 / this one confuses me a bit .. the corrugated pipe usually goes into the drain tub so water drain away normally .. do you mean its leaking from behind this ?

I'm wondering if the area the rear window in is filling up with water .. off hand i don't recall a drain grommet on the underside but there is on 991 cabs and its under a seal.

Hi Demort.

Problem 1 - Seals

The picture was taken with the hood closed and rear window open so I could take a picture. Its a pretty big gap so I guess I need to check the position of those seals when I get a chance. Looking at parts 13 and 17, I did wonder what they were and where they fitted. Again I will check that out when I look at it with the hood partly open.

Problem 2 - Drip from behind water collector/hopper

I've removed the corrugated pipe and replaced with a bit of garden hose for the moment (which is going into a tupperware tub; makes it easier to see behind the water collector. The corrugated pipe was all intact and in place before I removed it; its not cracked or anything. It looked like the water was coming down from behind the water collector though I could not see where it came from, only that there was a slight trickle of water coming down. I thought it might be from the open channel that ends where the corrugated pipe fits (that's why I removed the corrugated pipe to get a better view of that area. The only thing I have noticed is that there is a small "hopper" under the hinge/pivot for the hood (above top end of hydraulic ram) and on the passenger side this has water in whereas the one on the drivers side is dry. I cannot see how this little "pot" drains; perhaps it just overflows and dribbles into the main drainage? Picture attached.

Just for annoyance, after last night's downpour and the one we have just had this afternoon, neither side showed any sign of any water getting in. If I had any hair, I'd be pulling it out right now!

1 / That is wrong .. there shouldn,t be a gap that large .. check the other side to confirm .. there are 2 screws that hold that complete strip in place .. try adusting it if possible .. im not sure they move that much but its just wrong imho .

2 / you cant have an area that water collects but there is no way of it draining so if nothing there to drain then its not supposed to get there ..

That area is under the clam shell ( CTL ) lid drain .. there are several there but open the roof so that the CTL is fully lifted .. look in the " corner " and just above that area .. there are holes .. check the seal there ( inner side ) and pour a cup of water down that drain .. actually several cups .. see if any water ingress .

Can i suggest you move further south as it's far easier just to look at your car .. also this is getting to be a full time job

If I lived near Brighton I would be bringing it to you and handing over the cash - no question! I live in Cornwall half the year (though locked down in Essex) but that's probably too far the other way!

One thing I neglected to mention is that my car is parked on a slope (about 5 degrees) - so nearly 9% (or 1:11 in old money). Given it is parked nose down, the little collector with water in may not be draining as there is a cut out at the rear of it which, because of the slope, probably prevents the water running off into the normal drainage. I have poured water into it and when it overflows it drains into the big hopper and down drain in rear arch. I have poured water (again) over the hood, gap between body and CTL (that's something I've learnt!) and it all drains away where it should; nothing going anywhere it shouldn't. NOTE: I was getting water leaks when car pointed up the slope too (I switched it round as I originally thought it might be the slope causing it).

The little collector is still a mystery as regardless of where I pour water over the hood/body', nothing actually drains into it. I've taken the water out of it and dried it to see what happens during rain over next few days.

I am going to leave car stripped out until either I track this down or convince myself that the pixies have been at work and its all an aberration.

Haven't looked at the seals yet.

Your post with the cut out pictures .. very informative :thumb:

it's the little pipe that i didn't know what it drained , so from your picture below im wondering if that's the area the water is collecting ..

The pool of water you have that's not draining away is there i believe .

I can tell you that cabs can leak when pointed in one direction and not the other .. i've had one leak from the section in front of you but only when it was pointed slightly uphill and into the rain.

that was a case of lubrication and a bit of a seal modified to fit that stopped it .

I've gone through the parts diagrams for 997.2, 997.1 and 996 and cannot identify what that little water collector is. The only potential culprit for Leak 2, the one around the water hopper is the black corrugated tube. The tube itself is not broken BUT when I blow, really really hard with my finger covering the end with the rubber grommet a bit of air escapes from around the edge of the gromet. This seems unlikely to be the cause but just in case, I have put some silicone around the inner edge of the gromet where it wraps the end of the tube. I'm refitting it and waiting for heavy rain to see what happens. No water has come in on that side whilst garden hose attached.

Meanwhile, leak 1 from the seal is a git. I removed the seal (2xtorx 30) and there are 3 Torx 15 which I assumed held the seal to the carrier. However, it seems that the seal is bonded to the carrier and I am loath to apply force. I tried to move the whole unit when refitting but there is not that much to play with and nothing I did resulted in the gap closing. I'm going to have a crack at the rear seal next but that is currently in the same position as the one on the passenger side so I suspect is in the correct place. I have noticed a small tear at the leading edge of that seal and might bite the bullet and replace it when lockdown is over.

Normally with anything like this i would just have a look at a car at work ..

kinda stuck here as with DEE,s problem .. it's far easier for me to look at something than to work from pictures .

Fault 1 and compare it side to side to see what might be different .

Fault 2 .. difficult as behind that drain tub is just the window housing .. for water to reach the height of that tub then the entire chassis rail would be full.

Try removing the seat belt that side and water testing just to see if there is any water in there .. you can get your hand in there with the belt removed.

I very much doubt it but like you im kinda out of ideas atm.


EDIT

I've just looked at fault 1 pictures again .. the inside of the seal is butted up but the outside has a gap .. are both parts tight against the roof frame ?

just wondering if the front section has pushed up and it needs a new seal is all .

Thanks Demort. I'll give that a try. I've poured 2 gallons of water down the clamshell and side of hood and not a drop leaking in. As for the seals I'll drop hood down and check all the seals are fixed properly. As you say, on that one seal, it is butted up okay on the inside edge but there's a gap on the outside. It's almost like either that one or the rear seal have become misshapen in some way! I'll let you know how I get on-I think it's going to be a bit of trial and error on my part. It's a ***** that the seals are sooooo expensive otherwise I'd just buy a full set and replace the lot.

As an aside, I've been looking at used seals on eBay and whilst there seem to be plenty of rear ones the ones in the middle seem less available so that makes me wonder whether these generally take more of a beating.

Technically if its butted up tight on the inside then there is no adjustment you can make .. i've seen a few distorted seals over the years but nothing repetitive .. ie mainly 1 offs .

It's just that looking at the image .. it just looks distorted like one part has rolled inwards or something .. hence look side to side trying to see what's different .. trust me i do this a lot !!

I have hosed the hood down again (thank heavens I am not on a water meter) and no water is getting in anywhere; my neighbours must think I am a nutter. I will just have to keep an eye on things when weather turns again. Once things start to return to normal I am going to bite the bullet and replace the suspect seal.