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997 to 993 - Anyone done it?

Wot a load of bollox. I rarely post controversial comments on a forum. However not in this case. I've been driving a high mileage 993 C2 coupe, manual of course, as my daily driver for my 12 months of ownership.

I drove it to Dinslaken in May with 997phil and the 997 gang. It kept up and I had more fun than anyone else.

I love driving my 993 to work every day in Reading, driving down the M4 to Bath each weekend and using the roof rack to transport a rowing boat or bike.

The pedals don't bother me

Maintenance costs are high, a/c cost £2,000 to fix, and I bought at the top of the market so it will depreciate.
 
:grin: fair dos mate. I like your enthusiasm. A rowing boat indeed!
 
Don't know how you can compare the two . Never had a 997 and never want or wanted one. You either love air cooled or you don't . Simple as that for me . For me it's about how a car makes you feel when you smell it and drive it . Not how it drives . Yes a 997 got to be a better drive but so would a Ford Focus. Mountain Bike and road racing bike comes to mind . What's better . :?:
 
elee said:
Don't know how you can compare the two . Never had a 997 and never want or wanted one. You either love air cooled or you don't . Simple as that for me . For me it's about how a car makes you feel when you smell it and drive it . Not how it drives . Yes a 997 got to be a better drive but so would a Ford Focus. Mountain Bike and road racing bike comes to mind . What's better . :?:

I have a 993 and a 997. The 993 is smaller and has much more character, the 997 is more comfortable and is quicker. The 993, which I have had for 17 years, hits a sweet spot given the build quality, size, noise and reliability. You can use more of its performance on the roads as well.
 
I ***** love mine. Had a 964 originally which I loved and incidentally was no slower than a 997 in the real world. I remember taking it to North Wales with two friends who had 997s and was struggling to get my keys back off them. Eventually sold it as I got fed up with oil leaks and the maintenance costs. Bought a 987 Spyder which was a brilliant car to drive but ultimately not as enjoyable overall as the air-cooled car. Went back to an air-cooled 911 in the shape of a 993S, it being the one that I loved the most and it hasn't disappointed.

What I like about it:
It's a 911 (as is a 997).
Practical enough to use (as is a 997).
Air-cooled. The noise, smell, 'feel' of the engine is unique.
It reminds me of a VW Beetle I once had. Like a guilty pleasure.
I've lusted after one since they first came out.
They are super classy and you can turn up anywhere in one. To most people they don't even look valuable.
It will cross Europe without an issue, or equally be fun on a track day (as would a 997)
Fast enough to enjoy. And you feel the speed you are doing.
Small. You can hustle one along a B road still
Electronics have not taken over.
It has a 'man and machine' feeling.
The doors shut with a 'thunk'.
The upright windscreen.
993s are beautiful. It makes me smile just looking at one.

What I don't like (but am happy to put up with):
Holy Mother of God the maintenance bills can be eye watering.

Coming out of a 997, you will probably notice the smell of oil and the ancient looking cabin most. The cabin feels much older in places than the late 1990s. But then the 997 cabin looks dated now compared modern stuff. Other than that I can't see what's not to like.

Have had so many highlights in mine in the last couple of years. It has seen some of the best roads in Ireland, Scotland, Wales (multiple times)... even took it on a couple of business meetings just outside Nice in the South of France collecting speeding tickets from the Gendarmes along the Route Napoleon. Sunroof open, windows down up in the mountains listening to the engine and a bit of Serge Gainsbourg on the crappy stereo on my way back home is something I will never forget. Was still able to hit 160 chasing a new Audi coupe thing en route to the Tunnel.

Currently starting to hatch a plan to ship it to the States for a few weeks to do a road trip. I can tell you hand on heart that if I owned a 997 (and very, very good cars they are) I would not be doing this. Nor would I be doing it with any car I have ever owned before. There is just something special about it. They are both charming and engaging to drive. Some people get them, others don't.

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adamw said:
I'll argue the other way

Made my step in to 911 ownership back in 2009 with a 996 C2 and shortly after also had the air cooled itch.
Swapped 996 for 993 after just 14 months of 996 ownership.
Loved the 993 experience and kept it for 6 years.

Guess it depends how often you use and what you want from the car.
I understand the 993 may grate a little as a daily but it's such an occasion to drive as a weekend car :worship:

Still saying that I'm back in a 996 again now (albeit a turbo) so funny how things work out.

I'd say try a 993 for yourself and see what you think

Nice problem to have :thumb:

Exactly this! If it for an occasion drive a 993 fits the bill (bias aside). The 997 is a much better car but if you want the occasion the 993 fits the bill
 
tyinsky said:

I love how small and compact the 993 looks against that Micra
 
993s are very pretty, sound great and are well engineered. Are they worth their current values? No. I had one for nigh on 10 years, loved it, toured across France to Spain and back, fettled lots but eventually sold as it never got used much the final couple of years, I regret selling every time I see one, but have enjoyed other cars since and realised the 993 would not make a good daily, my 996 is way better in that respect..
 
Everyone to there own , and it's you what you need From the car . Daily then 993 no, but then again I wouldn't buy a water cooled Porsche for a daily, just dont like them ( well very few ) For a Sunday drive or something special 993 all day long . I could chop mine in for something special water cooled and go the other way , but to me that would be backwards.
 
I was very fond of both my 993s, particularly my very early pre-Varioram C2. However, I also feel the 997 is a very worthy successor. There is no way I'd have bought a 996, except maybe a Turbo.

Bottom line...would I go from my current 997.2 'back' to a 993.....NO...!
 
Paul Farrar said:
However, I also feel the 997 is a very worthy successor. There is no way I'd have bought a 996, except maybe a Turbo.

Absolutely agree with this. Last of the naturally aspirated cars (full line up), actually quite small, very pretty and, so far, a solid engine (gen2). A 993 for the modern chap.
 
MattyR said:
Paul Farrar said:
However, I also feel the 997 is a very worthy successor. There is no way I'd have bought a 996, except maybe a Turbo.

Absolutely agree with this. Last of the naturally aspirated cars (full line up), actually quite small, very pretty and, so far, a solid engine (gen2). A 993 for the modern chap.

Funny the 997 in modern terms is a small compact car, from the outside, and on the inside, the fact it was modelled (particularly inside) on the 993 says it all :thumb:
 
MattyR said:
Paul Farrar said:
However, I also feel the 997 is a very worthy successor. There is no way I'd have bought a 996, except maybe a Turbo.

Absolutely agree with this. Last of the naturally aspirated cars (full line up), actually quite small, very pretty and, so far, a solid engine (gen2). A 993 for the modern chap.

Huh. How exactly? 991.1 is the last of the NA cars (full line up). 993 is the very last of the true breed. It ended with this car. Something new began with the 996.

I'm not saying the 997 isn't any good, it's a great car but it is not a 993 for a modern chap (whatever that is). The notion that somehow either of these cars makes a good daily driver is laughable. They are both second cars, or if not they are at least for those who don't need a car everyday.

Earlier you mentioned the 993 is too hot inside to use in summer. Well get one with air conditioning then (or fix it). People seem to manage just fine in Cayman Rs, 987 Spyders and 997 GT3s which have been specced without. And it is personal choice to SORN one for winter as they drive just fine in the cold and wet. Struggling to work out what the 'you can do so much more in a 997" refers to? Can it transport four adults in comfort, go off roading or something like that?

:dont know:
 
tyinsky said:
MattyR said:
Paul Farrar said:
However, I also feel the 997 is a very worthy successor. There is no way I'd have bought a 996, except maybe a Turbo.

Absolutely agree with this. Last of the naturally aspirated cars (full line up), actually quite small, very pretty and, so far, a solid engine (gen2). A 993 for the modern chap.

Huh. How exactly? 991.1 is the last of the NA cars (full line up). 993 is the very last of the true breed. It ended with this car. Something new began with the 996.

I'm not saying the 997 isn't any good, it's a great car but it is not a 993 for a modern chap (whatever that is). The notion that somehow either of these cars makes a good daily driver is laughable. They are both second cars, or if not they are at least for those who don't need a car everyday.

Earlier you mentioned the 993 is too hot inside to use in summer. Well get one with air conditioning then (or fix it). People seem to manage just fine in Cayman Rs, 987 Spyders and 997 GT3s which have been specced without. And it is personal choice to SORN one for winter as they drive just fine in the cold and wet. Struggling to work out what the 'you can do so much more in a 997" refers to? Can it transport four adults in comfort, go off roading or something like that?

:dont know:

:bandit: It's great that everyone has such differing opinions of the various renditions of the 911 (however passionate they may be) and their varying attributes (positive or negative).

Whenever I compare the 997.2 to a 993 as being a worthy successor, or indeed lambast the 993 for not being a perfect motor (I'm sorry it's is far from that!), it invariably attracts some crisism. Having owned a 993 and driven a couple of versions of the gen2 997 I am simply presenting a) my past experience of owning a 993 and b) referencing this with what I perceive the 997.2 to now represent i.e. the natural successor to the 993 and, by extension, certain comparisons will arise that a lot of air-cooled folk will disagree with.

Not looking to disparage the 993 model in anyway, it's a great (read: truly special) car. My enthusiasm for the 997.2 is simply because I have found what I believe to be, in essence, a reborn 993. I'm actually quite excited by that comparison! Call me deluded, disagree or accuse me of sewing discord amongst the ranks.

The 997 range is the last full range to comprise of NA engines; that's what I was getting at. I fundamentally don't agree with the 993 being last of the true breed. It would be a shame to view any and all future 911 ranges as not being a true 911, would it not.

For me the 997.2 is a fine daily workhorse, the gen1 less so. Again, my view is that a 993 is not the ideal daily run-around and that realisation was borne of trying this out in practical terms. It was fun to try.

Air-con would have been advantageous but air cooled cars get much hotter sitting in traffic (one particular journey which I would not want to repeat was sitting on the M25 on my way to a wedding with my 3yo in the car).
Maybe what I should have said was that the 997.2 is a more usable 911 for my current needs i.e. kids, commuting, daily errands, weekend trips and the occasional bag of compost! It's viable as a main car if maintained correctly.
 
Heard about this thread on the 993 forum so have ventured over to the wasser forum to give my tuppence worth. I moved from a 2005 997.1 C4S to a 1995 993 C2.

I really enjoyed the 997.1. It was a beautiful car, great fun and very usable indeed. I did find though that one needed to be going really rather fast in order for it to feel really special.

I took a 993 cabriolet out for a test drive and within half an hour was in love with it - the sound, the smell, the weirdness of it all. The connection to the early 911s was tangible and it felt so special when compared to the cars than the other cars on the road. That's when I knew I needed an air-cooled in my life.

So I traded out of my 997 and into the 993 (was actually looking for everything from SC onwards but plumped for a 993 in the end for daily usability). I actually do use it daily including getting stuck in slow traffic for nigh on an hour on the way to work today. I concede that it is annoying in traffic, I stall it in reverse on occasion and it isn't anywhere near as refined as the 997.1 - but I always knew it wasn't going to be. For me, it feels special every single day and that is why I love it.

Conclusion: each to their own. I'm sticking with the 993 though.

some gratuitous pics of both cars attached...no excuse needed!
 

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